On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:

> On 12/17/24 4:34 AM, D wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Mon, 16 Dec 2024, Lars Poulsen wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 15 Dec 2024 23:09:13 +0100, D wrote:
>>> D> Ahh... the land of the free! Try 31% in sweden or around 20% where I am
>>> D> now. Oh, and the 31% has a cap, so you only get part of that to fund
>>> D> your own retirement. The rest goes to happy arabians!
>>>
>>> On Mon, 16 Dec 2024, rbowman wrote:
>>> rb> There is a yearly maximum for the SS tax, which gets raised
>>> frequently. It
>>> rb> was nice to max out and have a few weeks without the deduction at the
>>> end
>>> rb> of the year. The current cap is $168,600 so I would guess the majority
>>> of
>>> rb> the workers don't see those bonus weeks anymore.
>>>
>>> On 2024-12-16, D <nospam@example.net> wrote:
>>>> Jesus! I thought it was only in sweden. Well, as you say it's 168k, so I
>>>> imagine that the majority of people in the US never hit the cap.
>>>
>>> rb> Of course your benefits are taxed. Some states don't tax SS benefits
>>> but
>>> rb> this one does so both the Feds and the state have their hands out.
>>> Then if
>>> rb> you have an IRA or other retirement account there is a required
>>> minimum
>>> rb> distribution yearly which is taxed when you hit 73.
>>>
>>>> Of course it is taxed! ;) And your private retirement savings are taxed
>>>> as
>>>> well, so a nice double tax. First the salary, and then you save it, and
>>>> it
>>>> is of course taxed again at withdrawal.
>>>
>>> The salary that goes into the retirement account is NOT taxed (the
>>> contribution is tax deductible in the year it is earned) but when you
>>> take money out later,  the withdrawals are taxable income. Not so
>>> unfair.
>>>
>>>> If you're content to wait until you are at least 55 to withdraw money,
>>>> you
>>>> can start a retirement foundation. The gross assets are taxed with a flat
>>>> tax of 0.3% or so every year, regardless of if the assets shrink or grow.
>>>> And in return you can withdraw your retirement savings for free. This is
>>>> not very well known, and I have never heard of a company that offers
>>>> this.
>>>
>>> So an after-tax savings account. How is this different from an ordinary
>>> savings account ... I guess the difference is that the interest is
>>> tax-free? Sweden special!
>>
>> The difference is that in an ordinary savings account, you put in taxed
>> money. In this type of account, your company can put in gross earnings,
>> have the capital gains being taxed at only 0.3% (ish) flat fee per year,
>> and then when you, the employee, withdraw it, it's taxed as retirement
>> income.
>
> There's barely any POINT in such plans if the money is
> eventually taxed (at current rates) when you finally
> need it. May as well have just made an ordinary bank
> savings account or similar - you will get more back
> when all is said and done.

You are a wise man! That is exactly why my retirement savings consists on
a regular account, within the shell of my company (to cut the tax from 30%
to 15%).

Some stuff I need to do, I can then just do on behalf of the company, and
basically use gross earnings towards that. If I need pocket money, I need
to bite the bullet and pay 15% (plus of course the corp tax at 15%).

>> If you put in your taxed savings into a "kapitalförsäkring" you can
>> withdraw the money tax free, but the flat tax is higher, it's currently
>> 0,888% for 2025.
>>
>> How did you do the rb/D quoting? Do you have a script for that? It was very
>> beautiful.
>

On 19/12/2024 04:28, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
>
>> For thousands of years the presence of modern humans in Britain
>> remained brief and sporadic. It has only been continuous since about
>> 12,000 years ago.
>
>
>   Probably rates as one of the worlds "Most Invaded" places.
>   Don't think anybody can make a really solid "historical
>   claim" on England.

I think that goes for most of Europe - at least the warmer more central
parts and the Mediterranean.

They got the Indo-Europeans while the Nordics got the blond blue eyed
lot and where they met, redheads...

....and then Ghengis Khan, probably the greatest genocidal psychopath in
history, spread his guy's genes all over the place.

The origins of Native Americans - especially S Americans, is still
being worked on.

--
“it should be clear by now to everyone that activist environmentalism
(or environmental activism) is becoming a general ideology about humans,
about their freedom, about the relationship between the individual and
the state, and about the manipulation of people under the guise of a
'noble' idea. It is not an honest pursuit of 'sustainable development,'
a matter of elementary environmental protection, or a search for
rational mechanisms designed to achieve a healthy environment. Yet
things do occur that make you shake your head and remind yourself that
you live neither in Joseph Stalin’s Communist era, nor in the Orwellian
utopia of 1984.”

Vaclav Klaus

On 19/12/2024 05:16, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
> On 12/18/24 11:28 PM, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
>> On 12/18/24 5:00 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>>
>>> For thousands of years the presence of modern humans in Britain
>>> remained brief and sporadic. It has only been continuous since about
>>> 12,000 years ago.
>>
>>
>>    Probably rates as one of the worlds "Most Invaded" places.
>>    Don't think anybody can make a really solid "historical
>>    claim" on England.
>
>   Hmmm ... as for 'claims' ... how much, in what forms,
>   does anyone have a claim on programming code ? Some
>   of this stuff goes back to Turing - indeed probably
>   back to Babbage/Lovelace. You can re-state the ideas,
>   put them together a bit differently, but they're
>   still kind of 'stolen', 'sequels'.

And in fact similar conditions evoke similar responses.

I learnt most of my programming from doing it: later on you find some
academic has worked it out too, and given it a name and claimed it...

--
"I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently.
This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and
all women"

On 19/12/2024 05:00, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
> Alas, like time travel, the more you think about
>   'mind uploading' the more improbable it seems.
>   'Mind' is COMPLICATED ... and there's more than
>   just neurons involved. 'Mind' is an 'environment'.

Ah. The 'Akashic Records' were all the rage in the early/mid 20th
century. The place where all minds are uploaded after death. Or
something. Google it.

--
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false face for the
urge to rule it.”
– H. L. Mencken

On 19/12/2024 09:39, D wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, 18 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

>> It was supposed to be amanita muscaria intoxication.
>> Except that doesn't make people violent
>
> Yes! I always heard this as well, but as far as I've read (and heard) it
> results in vomiting and just feeling bad.
>

Er no. And the vomiting is absent if you drink the urine of someone or
something - reindeer will do - that has eaten the shroom.

Apparently visions of Asgard etc.

https://erowid.org/plants/amanitas/amanitas_writings4.shtml#part_two

>> Relief from nagging Nordic nannies sounds about right tho.
>
> ;)

--
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false face for the
urge to rule it.”
– H. L. Mencken

On 19/12/2024 09:40, D wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, 18 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 18/12/2024 19:34, D wrote:
>>> When asked about beautiful women in the UK the ginger man said they
>>> are horrible, drink too much beer, get drunk and then fight each other.
>>>
>>> Is this true?
>>
>> It has been known....
>>
>
> How sad. =(

Saturday night fever...

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Cartoons%20and%20Politics/DrunkerJuncker.jpg

--
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false face for the
urge to rule it.”
– H. L. Mencken

On 19/12/2024 09:51, D wrote:
> I have contemplated ditching planes for trains, but I don't think the
> result would be much better. Perhaps less security theater?

In Europe that works OK - at least city to city.

I live in E of England, . my sister lives in W Germany near the Moselle.
She gave a birthday party for her husbands 80th.
I drove all the way with a ferry crossing
My nephew took the Eurostar from London and hired a car.
My cousin took a plane and hired a car.

The door to door journey times were almost identical

OTOH if you want to get from central Glasgow to Central London a plane
and train is by far the quickest.

Not so much security on what is essentially a commuter flight

--
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false face for the
urge to rule it.”
– H. L. Mencken

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 19/12/2024 09:39, D wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Wed, 18 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>>> It was supposed to be amanita muscaria intoxication.
>>> Except that doesn't make people violent
>>
>> Yes! I always heard this as well, but as far as I've read (and heard) it
>> results in vomiting and just feeling bad.
>>
>
> Er no. And the vomiting is absent if you drink the urine of someone or
> something - reindeer will do - that has eaten the shroom.

Have not tried. Please let me know if you do!

> Apparently visions of Asgard etc.
>
> https://erowid.org/plants/amanitas/amanitas_writings4.shtml#part_two

What happens if you eat a fly agaric?
Table of contents show

It is part of the genus Amanita, which contains both edible and very
poisonous species. The red fly agaric is moderately poisonous. Consumption
can cause a variety of symptoms, ranging from nausea and sweating, to
euphoria and hallucinations. Deaths are extremely rare, but have occurred.
Can you die from eating a fly agaric?

The mushroom is poisonous!

Ingestion can cause dizziness, confusion, anxiety, decreased consciousness
and in severe cases convulsions. Sometimes nausea and vomiting occur.
These symptoms are not life-threatening but may require observation and
treatment in hospital.

>>> Relief from nagging Nordic nannies sounds about right tho. >> >> ;)
>
>

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 19/12/2024 09:51, D wrote:
>> I have contemplated ditching planes for trains, but I don't think the
>> result would be much better. Perhaps less security theater?
>
> In Europe that works OK - at least city to city.
>
> I live in E of England, . my sister lives in W Germany near the Moselle. She
> gave a birthday party for her husbands 80th.
> I drove all the way with a ferry crossing
> My nephew took the Eurostar from London and hired a car.
> My cousin took a plane and hired a car.
>
> The door to door journey times were almost identical
>
> OTOH if you want to get from central Glasgow to Central London a plane and
> train is by far the quickest.
>
> Not so much security on what is essentially a commuter flight

I once visited a super computing conference in Manchester. I flew in to
Ryan airs airport, a small one that I don't remember the name of.

Then I took a train from London to Manchester and it was on time, clean,
tidy, and in front of me I had an english man who enjoyed beer and potato
chips and was very talkative.

Once I arrived I discovered my mistake.

Actually _my_ train was delayed with 1 hour, and by accident I'd gotten on
the previous train that was delayed one hour, and sat in the wrong seat.

Fortunately no one cared, and all was good!

Manchester was nice, but it was raining all the time.

On 19/12/2024 14:58, D wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 19/12/2024 09:39, D wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 18 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>>> It was supposed to be amanita muscaria intoxication.
>>>> Except that doesn't make people violent
>>>
>>> Yes! I always heard this as well, but as far as I've read (and heard)
>>> it results in vomiting and just feeling bad.
>>>
>>
>> Er no. And the vomiting is absent if you drink the urine of someone or
>> something - reindeer will do - that has eaten the shroom.
>
> Have not tried. Please let me know if you do!
>
>> Apparently visions of Asgard etc.
>>
>> https://erowid.org/plants/amanitas/amanitas_writings4.shtml#part_two
>
> What happens if you eat a fly agaric?
> Table of contents show
>
> It is part of the genus Amanita, which contains both edible and very
> poisonous species. The red fly agaric is moderately poisonous.
> Consumption can cause a variety of symptoms, ranging from nausea and
> sweating, to euphoria and hallucinations. Deaths are extremely rare, but
> have occurred.
> Can you die from eating a fly agaric?
>
I dont believe anyone has, but its possible that the more orange species
can be confused with Amanita pantherina, the panther cap.

Of course two other Amanitas are deadly. Amanita Virosa and Amanita
Phalloides - the 'destroying angel' and the death cap. Probably used to
kill many a mediaeval lord who beat up on his wife...you get sick, then
you get better, then all your organs fail and you die.

Other amanitas are 'edible and good'...

"Edible species of Amanita include Amanita fulva, Amanita vaginata
(grisette), Amanita calyptrata (coccoli), Amanita crocea, Amanita
rubescens (blusher), Amanita caesarea (Caesar's mushroom), and Amanita
jacksonii (American Caesar's mushroom)."

> The mushroom is poisonous!
>
That's why you give it to someone else and drink their urine!

Body breaks down the nasty shit but passes the muscimol straight through.

> Ingestion can cause dizziness, confusion, anxiety, decreased
> consciousness and in severe cases convulsions. Sometimes nausea and
> vomiting occur. These symptoms are not life-threatening but may require
> observation and treatment in hospital.
>
That's more or less bollocks.

--
Future generations will wonder in bemused amazement that the early
twenty-first century’s developed world went into hysterical panic over a
globally average temperature increase of a few tenths of a degree, and,
on the basis of gross exaggerations of highly uncertain computer
projections combined into implausible chains of inference, proceeded to
contemplate a rollback of the industrial age.

Richard Lindzen

On 19/12/2024 15:01, D wrote:
> Manchester was nice, but it was raining all the time.

"Canada is all right, just not for the *whole* weekend" :-)

Stuff Manchester, It always rains.
Do do Ireland and Wales, but at leasts they have nice greenery to look at.

--
The theory of Communism may be summed up in one sentence: Abolish all
private property.

Karl Marx

D <nospam@example.net> wrote:
> I have contemplated ditching planes for trains, but I don't think the
> result would be much better. Perhaps less security theater?

Here in the US, what little "train service" we have has zero security
theater. You arrive, walk in with your luggage rolling behind you, and
no one checks you over, pats you down, feels you up, or otherwise does
anything "security check" wise. You show your ticket at the counter
(to prove you purchased a ticket), go sit and wait, walk out to the
train with your luggage when it is time, and climb aboard.

rbowman <bowman@montana.com> writes:

> On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 22:03:07 -0500, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
>
>> Thing is, there have been odd genetic/physiotype mixes found from
>> around those times. Likely the ice melt encouraged a lot of people to
>> wander around.
>
> Global warming! I'm pretty sure nobody was camping in my yard about 15,000
> years BP.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glacial_Lake_Missoula
>
> There are several markers on the trails at the 4200' level. It's fun to
> imagine a lake where the valley is.
On one of our RV trips to Montana and the Pacific Nortwest we visited
the National Bison Range north of Missoula. The road winds around and
over some pretty good hills. High up on one of the hills is a roadside
sign saying words to the effect of: "you are looking over the Mission
Valley to the southern Mission Mountains. 15,000 years ago, you would be
looking over a vast lake, probably with floating icebergs." Quite
impressive; the valley was hu-u-ge.
--
-Don_from_AZ-

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:26:17 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> Er no. And the vomiting is absent if you drink the urine of someone or
> something - reindeer will do - that has eaten the shroom.

That was the original trickle down effect. Hopefully it worked better than
it ever did in economics.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:42:45 +0100, D wrote:

> What a missed opportunity! Imagine you now, 4 wifes, 40 children!

A character, Seldom Seen Smith in Ed Abbey's 'The Monkey Wrench Gang' made
good use of that. You spread the wives throughout Utah so you always have
a home as you wander around.

One wife was quite enough, thank you.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:51:43 +0100, D wrote:

> Yes... it's absolutely horrible. Add to that, for a guy with problems
> with authorities like me, the eternal hassles with retarded security, ID
> controls, arbitrary rules and regulations, and just the general
> unpleasantness of the planes and seats themselves, it's a nightmare!

Somehow I always get randomly selected. I thought I had it nailed once, no
knives, guns, nail clippers, grenades, or other objects on my person. I
found the dress shoes I was wearing had steel shanks.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 15:35:57 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 19/12/2024 15:01, D wrote:
>> Manchester was nice, but it was raining all the time.
>
> "Canada is all right, just not for the *whole* weekend" :-)
>
> Stuff Manchester, It always rains.
> Do do Ireland and Wales, but at leasts they have nice greenery to look
> at.

People in the US of Irish descent have some compulsion to return to the
'Auld Sod'. After a friend returned I asked him how it was. 'Green! It
should be green. It rains all the fucking time!'

I can only speculate why my people left Germany. There was no family lore
about the old country and no one had an interest in returning. That's not
to say they weren't proud of their ethnicity.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 16:28:55 -0000 (UTC), Rich wrote:

> D <nospam@example.net> wrote:
>> I have contemplated ditching planes for trains, but I don't think the
>> result would be much better. Perhaps less security theater?
>
> Here in the US, what little "train service" we have has zero security
> theater. You arrive, walk in with your luggage rolling behind you, and
> no one checks you over, pats you down, feels you up, or otherwise does
> anything "security check" wise. You show your ticket at the counter (to
> prove you purchased a ticket), go sit and wait, walk out to the train
> with your luggage when it is time, and climb aboard.

I wondered about that. I haven't taken a train in over 40 years. I would
have to drive 135 miles to get to a passenger train station.

On 19/12/2024 16:28, Rich wrote:
> D <nospam@example.net> wrote:
>> I have contemplated ditching planes for trains, but I don't think the
>> result would be much better. Perhaps less security theater?
>
> Here in the US, what little "train service" we have has zero security
> theater. You arrive, walk in with your luggage rolling behind you, and
> no one checks you over, pats you down, feels you up, or otherwise does
> anything "security check" wise. You show your ticket at the counter
> (to prove you purchased a ticket), go sit and wait, walk out to the
> train with your luggage when it is time, and climb aboard.
>
Pretty much the same in Europe except you may need to show passports
when crossing some national boundaries.

--
The New Left are the people they warned you about.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 19/12/2024 15:01, D wrote:
>> Manchester was nice, but it was raining all the time.
>
> "Canada is all right, just not for the *whole* weekend" :-)
>
> Stuff Manchester, It always rains.
> Do do Ireland and Wales, but at leasts they have nice greenery to look at.

And probably more sheep!

On 19/12/2024 17:24, rbowman wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 15:35:57 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 19/12/2024 15:01, D wrote:
>>> Manchester was nice, but it was raining all the time.
>>
>> "Canada is all right, just not for the *whole* weekend" :-)
>>
>> Stuff Manchester, It always rains.
>> Do do Ireland and Wales, but at leasts they have nice greenery to look
>> at.
>
> People in the US of Irish descent have some compulsion to return to the
> 'Auld Sod'. After a friend returned I asked him how it was. 'Green! It
> should be green. It rains all the fucking time!'
>
> I can only speculate why my people left Germany. There was no family lore
> about the old country and no one had an interest in returning. That's not
> to say they weren't proud of their ethnicity.

Irish left because it was better than dying of starvation in a massively
overpopulated country.
Many N Europeans left because they were simply too pious to be
tolerated. As where the original pilgrim fathers.
English left because they were second sons and had no estates, but they
had enough to buy them in the Americas.
Italians probably left to escape poverty, like the Irish.

--
The lifetime of any political organisation is about three years before
its been subverted by the people it tried to warn you about.

Anon.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, Rich wrote:

> D <nospam@example.net> wrote:
>> I have contemplated ditching planes for trains, but I don't think the
>> result would be much better. Perhaps less security theater?
>
> Here in the US, what little "train service" we have has zero security
> theater. You arrive, walk in with your luggage rolling behind you, and
> no one checks you over, pats you down, feels you up, or otherwise does
> anything "security check" wise. You show your ticket at the counter
> (to prove you purchased a ticket), go sit and wait, walk out to the
> train with your luggage when it is time, and climb aboard.

This is very promising! I imagine they have a very beautiful restaurant
where you can enjoy a glass of champagne, and perhaps a delicious 3 course
meal as well? =D

Or maybe it is the swedish version, where you get to enjoy an old, plastic
wrapped sandwich? ;)

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, rbowman wrote:

> On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:42:45 +0100, D wrote:
>
>> What a missed opportunity! Imagine you now, 4 wifes, 40 children!
>
> A character, Seldom Seen Smith in Ed Abbey's 'The Monkey Wrench Gang' made
> good use of that. You spread the wives throughout Utah so you always have
> a home as you wander around.
>
> One wife was quite enough, thank you.
>

;)

I once had 2 during a transition period, and I agree with you.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:49:37 +0100, D wrote:

> Haha, brilliant! I assume there must have been a chinese jarl as well?
> My wife gets very annoyed when they populate historical dramas with
> black,
> yellow or red people who have no business appearing in 17:th century
> europe at the top of society.

But, but... I have the DVD set of James Levine's Ring Cycle at the
Metropolitan Opera in '89. Jessye Norman has the Sieglinde and somehow
didn't look like Siegmund's twin. Opera at least has the excuse that you
need someone who can sing. Hildegard Behrens played Brünnhilde and while
she did her best one of the criticisms was she was a bit long in the tooth
for the role.

Levine has a few cameos on the DVD and looked greasy. I wasn't surprised
when he was fired over allegations he had abused some young men.

> What about lord of the rings? Have there poped up versions with chinese
> trans elves yet?

Amazon's 'Rings of Power' does have someone who isn't exactly a Light Elf.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ismael_Cruz_C%C3%B3rdova

I haven't watched it but it didn't get very good reviews. The kindest say
the scenery is beautiful but the acting stunk.

On Thu, 19 Dec 2024, rbowman wrote:

> On Thu, 19 Dec 2024 10:51:43 +0100, D wrote:
>
>> Yes... it's absolutely horrible. Add to that, for a guy with problems
>> with authorities like me, the eternal hassles with retarded security, ID
>> controls, arbitrary rules and regulations, and just the general
>> unpleasantness of the planes and seats themselves, it's a nightmare!
>
> Somehow I always get randomly selected. I thought I had it nailed once, no
> knives, guns, nail clippers, grenades, or other objects on my person. I
> found the dress shoes I was wearing had steel shanks.
>

It's the ponytail. Always the ponytail.