Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering
whether Boeing will call this a success or not.

Alain Fournier

Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering whether
> Boeing will call this a success or not.
>
>
> Alain Fournier

We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although
getting crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a
milestone passed.

I expect that Starliner's next flight will be a cargo mission, and NET
January; July 2025 might be more likely.

/dps

--
But happiness cannot be pursued; it must ensue. One must have a reason
to 'be happy.'"
Viktor Frankl

On 06/09/2024 17:35 Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering
> whether Boeing will call this a success or not.
>

Both Boeing and NASA are at fault here. The same thruster problems manifested
themselves on both previous flights. Boeing said they would solve them
by making "software adjustments." NASA should've kept more oversight on
how the changes were tested and implemented.

If Starliner gets home without a hitch Boeing will argue that the safety
scare was unnecessary and that the next flight should be a regular
Commercial Crew flight for which they expect to be paid. Or they'll
demand NASA reimburse them for another CFT.

On 06/09/2024 21:43 Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> wrote:
> Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering whether
>> Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>
>>
>> Alain Fournier
>
> We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although
> getting crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a
> milestone passed.
>
> I expect that Starliner's next flight will be a cargo mission, and NET
> January; July 2025 might be more likely.
>

A CARGO mission?! I don't think Boeing will agree to that.

On Friday or thereabouts, The Running Man declared ...
> On 06/09/2024 21:43 Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
>>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering whether
>>> Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>>
>> We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although
>> getting crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a
>> milestone passed.
>>
>> I expect that Starliner's next flight will be a cargo mission, and NET
>> January; July 2025 might be more likely.
>>
>
> A CARGO mission?! I don't think Boeing will agree to that.

If NASA pays for it? See Eric Berger's comments.

/dps

--
Trust, but verify.

Snidely formulated the question :
> Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering whether
>> Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>
>>
>> Alain Fournier
>
> We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although getting
> crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a milestone passed.

Exited Approach Ellipsoid.

-d

--
Maybe C282Y is simply one of the hangers-on, a groupie following a
future guitar god of the human genome: an allele with undiscovered
virtuosity, currently soloing in obscurity in Mom's garage.
Bradley Wertheim, theAtlantic.com, Jan 10 2013

Watch this space, where The Running Man advised that...
> On 06/09/2024 17:35 Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering
>> whether Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>
>
> Both Boeing and NASA are at fault here. The same thruster problems manifested
> themselves on both previous flights. Boeing said they would solve them
> by making "software adjustments." NASA should've kept more oversight on
> how the changes were tested and implemented.

Yes.

> If Starliner gets home without a hitch Boeing will argue that the safety
> scare was unnecessary and that the next flight should be a regular
> Commercial Crew flight for which they expect to be paid. Or they'll
> demand NASA reimburse them for another CFT.

No. There will be a cargo flight, which NASA will pay for, on a
separate contract. Boeing is on the hook for all other costs.

/dps

--
Let's celebrate Macaronesia

On Friday, Snidely yelped out that:
> Snidely formulated the question :
>> Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
>>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering whether
>>> Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>>
>> We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although
>> getting crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a milestone
>> passed.
>
> Exited Approach Ellipsoid.

For more information about Starliner's heatshield, which doesn't seem
to be a point of concern (unlike Orion's), see Scott Manley's
discussion:

<URL:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPwMkU0HSOM&t=310s>

Also, some info on the sequencing at the NSF forums:

<URL:https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=56372.280>

/dps

--
Hurray or Huzzah?

Friday, Snidely quipped:
> On Friday, Snidely yelped out that:
>> Snidely formulated the question :
>>> Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
>>>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering
>>>> whether Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Alain Fournier
>>>
>>> We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although
>>> getting crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a milestone
>>> passed.
>>
>> Exited Approach Ellipsoid.
>
> For more information about Starliner's heatshield, which doesn't seem to be a
> point of concern (unlike Orion's), see Scott Manley's discussion:
>
> <URL:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPwMkU0HSOM&t=310s>
>
> Also, some info on the sequencing at the NSF forums:
>
> <URL:https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=56372.280>
>
> /dps

Heatshield and parachutes performed, trunk scrapped, and Starliner crew
module and cargo on the ground with a good touchdown.

/dps

--
I have always been glad we weren't killed that night. I do not know
any particular reason, but I have always been glad.
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain

On 07/09/2024 06:13 Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> wrote:
> Friday, Snidely quipped:
>> On Friday, Snidely yelped out that:
>>> Snidely formulated the question :
>>>> Remember Friday, when Alain Fournier asked plaintively:
>>>>> Starliner should be coming home today and tomorrow. I am wondering
>>>>> whether Boeing will call this a success or not.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Alain Fournier
>>>>
>>>> We'll have to see what happens? It's a bit early to decide, although
>>>> getting crew /to/ the ISS is a major part of the mission, and a milestone
>>>> passed.
>>>
>>> Exited Approach Ellipsoid.
>>
>> For more information about Starliner's heatshield, which doesn't seem to be a
>> point of concern (unlike Orion's), see Scott Manley's discussion:
>>
>> <URL:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPwMkU0HSOM&t=310s>
>>
>> Also, some info on the sequencing at the NSF forums:
>>
>> <URL:https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=56372.280>
>>
>> /dps
>
> Heatshield and parachutes performed, trunk scrapped, and Starliner crew
> module and cargo on the ground with a good touchdown.
>

So now the bickering starts.

Boeing will argue that there was nothing wrong
with Starliner and it should've returned with crew on board.

I personally side with NASA since there are simply too many
unknowns. Just because it worked this time doesn't mean it
will next time. We need to be absolutely sure these thrusters work
during all phases of the flight or they need to be redesigned.

NASA also needs to add more instrumentation in the service module
to get more daa on what's going on during thruster firings.