After nerva ablation and steriod injection didn't seem to work on my
back pain, the doc now wants me to get a spinal cord stimulator. The
brochure he gave me for the one-week trial is printed on very thick
paper has little text and much white space and nothing about the nevro
HFX app. I finally figured out that that's because the trial doesn't
use the app, but the "permanent" version has only an iPhone app. People
have been asking for over a year for an Android version. (The treatment
is FDA-approved for 9 years but I don't know how long they've had an
app.)

How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?

Even if a separate style stimulator would also be needed, how hard is it
to modify the programs to work on an Android phone. It sounds simple to
me. In PC language, only the drivers would have to be changed, because
they interface between the software and the hardware. Isnt' it already
well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
(There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
the app does much more.)

On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:

<[snip]
>
> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>
No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.
>
> Even if a separate style stimulator would also be needed, how hard is it
> to modify the programs to work on an Android phone. It sounds simple to
> me. In PC language, only the drivers would have to be changed, because
> they interface between the software and the hardware. Isnt' it already
> well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
> (There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
> the app does much more.)

What you should ask is - what minimum version of iOS does the app need? If
it runs on an oldish iPhone just buy a cheap one. Someone will probably
give you one - I've never paid for an iPhone yet. But I might, if I had
your back problem.
--
Remove numerics from my email address.

micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
> After nerva ablation and steriod injection didn't seem to work on my
> back pain, the doc now wants me to get a spinal cord stimulator. The
> brochure he gave me for the one-week trial is printed on very thick
> paper has little text and much white space and nothing about the nevro
> HFX app. I finally figured out that that's because the trial doesn't
> use the app, but the "permanent" version has only an iPhone app. People
> have been asking for over a year for an Android version. (The treatment
> is FDA-approved for 9 years but I don't know how long they've had an
> app.)
>
> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app?

Harder than you think. Plus then the manufacturer has to support twice the
number of systems they supported before.

> Is the
> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>
>
> Even if a separate style stimulator would also be needed, how hard is it
> to modify the programs to work on an Android phone. It sounds simple to
> me. In PC language,

What is that and how is it different to mobile language?

> only the drivers would have to be changed, because
> they interface between the software and the hardware.

You know this how?

> Isnt' it already
> well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
> (There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
> the app does much more.)

iOS apps are written in Swift and Android ones are written in a form of
Java. There are ways to be able to write to both platforms at the same
time, but you would need to plan that from the start. So, it sounds like it
would require a completely new app for Android.

In comp.mobile.android, on Wed, 6 Nov 2024 17:54:08 -0000 (UTC), Dave
Royal <dave@dave123royal.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:
>
><[snip]
>>
>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>>
>No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
>licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.
>>
>> Even if a separate style stimulator would also be needed, how hard is it
>> to modify the programs to work on an Android phone. It sounds simple to
>> me. In PC language, only the drivers would have to be changed, because
>> they interface between the software and the hardware. Isnt' it already
>> well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
>> (There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
>> the app does much more.)
>
>What you should ask is - what minimum version of iOS does the app need? If
>it runs on an oldish iPhone just buy a cheap one. Someone will probably
>give you one - I've never paid for an iPhone yet. But I might, if I had
>your back problem.

After I posted, I found online: "this application will work on select
iOS devices: iPhone 7 and above running iOS 13 or later. his application
will work on select iOS devices: iPhone 7 and above running iOS 13 or
later...." Latest release is 18.1, so that leaves a lot of phones no
one really wants that I could buy.

But when I asked the rep, she said they would lend me an iphone. I
guess that's for the rest of my life, unless she meant "until I can buy
one", but she gave no hint that she meant the latter. I'll ask again.

There are other medical etc. subjective reasons I'm not sure I want to
do this, but this one can be evaluated objectively, and there is no
newsgroup for the medical ones. .

In comp.mobile.android, on Wed, 6 Nov 2024 20:58:22 -0000 (UTC), Chris
<ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>Harder than you think. Plus then the manufacturer has to support twice the
>number of systems they supported before.
>.....
>
>> Isnt' it already
>> well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
>> (There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
>> the app does much more.)
>
>iOS apps are written in Swift and Android ones are written in a form of
>Java. There are ways to be able to write to both platforms at the same
>time, but you would need to plan that from the start. So, it sounds like it
>would require a completely new app for Android.

You've convinced me. Tnx to both of you.

On Wed, 6 Nov 2024 17:54:08 -0000 (UTC), Dave Royal wrote:
> On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:
>
><[snip]
>>
>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>>
> No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
> licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.

Plus the stimulator+android lash-up would have to go through all the FDA
approval process(es) again.

In comp.mobile.android, on 7 Nov 2024 14:43:45 GMT, Allodoxaphobia
<trepidation@example.net> wrote:

>On Wed, 6 Nov 2024 17:54:08 -0000 (UTC), Dave Royal wrote:
>> On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:
>>
>><[snip]
>>>
>>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>>>
>> No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
>> licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.
>
>Plus the stimulator+android lash-up would have to go through all the FDA
>approval process(es) again.

Good point. I always (well, since they came out with them) thought
there are more android than iphones** because they are so much???
cheaper and just as good, but a friend tells me there are a lot more
iphones.

**And therefore apps would be written for android first and iphone next.
My back is not as bad as a lot of the people getting this treatment.
Their own brochure omits "aching pain" which I guess is what they call
what I have, and says it's for contant shooting, burning, stabbing,
and/or numbness that doesn't get better when you sit or lay [sic] down.
I'm sure I've told the doctor that it doesn't hurt when I'm sitting or
lying down.

I think he might be like a horse that aiui takes the bit in his mouth
and races for his own desires as much as the rider's**. The doc wants to
fix me.

And yet most days just walking hurts most of the time, keeps me from
geting much done. And all the non-prsecription drugs have the same
effect, not much at all. Tylenol, aspirin, ibuprofin, aleve. Ibuprofin
is supposed to stop (a certain kind of) pain at its source, but take too
much or even the right amount for too many days and it messes up your
stomach. Don't know whether to do the spinal cord stimulation or not.

micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> Wrote in message:

> In comp.mobile.android, on 7 Nov 2024 14:43:45 GMT, Allodoxaphobia
> <trepidation@example.net> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 6 Nov 2024 17:54:08 -0000 (UTC), Dave Royal wrote:
>>> On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:
>>>
>>><[snip]
>>>>
>>>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>>>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>>>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>>>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>>>>
>>> No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
>>> licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.
>>
>>Plus the stimulator+android lash-up would have to go through all the FDA
>>approval process(es) again.
>
> Good point. I always (well, since they came out with them) thought
> there are more android than iphones** because they are so much???
> cheaper and just as good, but a friend tells me there are a lot more
> iphones.

Last time I investigated there were far more Android phones
worldwide. In the US, which had the highest proportion of
iPhones, it was about 50/50 with Android. More significant,
perhaps, is that I bet iPhones predominate among those who can
access this sort of medical treatment.

I wonder if the FDA have to re-approve each new release if the
app? If so it might be expensive for the supplier to resubmit all
the tests. Probably depends on whether the app is deemed 'safety
critical' - i.e. could it kill you?
--
Remove numerics from my email address.

micky, 2024-11-06 18:10:

[...]
> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the

It depends on what the app does. There is no simple answer like "it will
take x days".

> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?

Everything(!) is different. Depending on how they developed the app, it
would be neccessary to use Kotlin or Java instead of Swift. It's also
not very likely, that the app is using a cross platform framework like
Capacitor with Angular - because then they would already have an app for
Android devices too.

> Even if a separate style stimulator would also be needed, how hard is it
> to modify the programs to work on an Android phone. It sounds simple to

As explained above: everthing is different, not just the brand of the phone.

> me. In PC language, only the drivers would have to be changed, because

No, there are no "drivers". The app uses Bluetooth to communicate with
the device. An Android version would "just" have to implement the same
features - but with a completely different programming language on an
operating system which is based on Linux und Android instead of iOS.

It is like porting a native Windows application to MacOS or Linux - this
is also not an easy task, if you did not use cross platform tools like
Qt or Electron.

> they interface between the software and the hardware. Isnt' it already
> well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
> (There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
> the app does much more.)

Even if the creators would know what to do - someone has to pay that.
And I would not expect much less than at least 50000-100000 USD for that
(2-3 months of development and testing for around 1500 USD per day -
minimum).

--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de

Allodoxaphobia, 2024-11-07 15:43:

> On Wed, 6 Nov 2024 17:54:08 -0000 (UTC), Dave Royal wrote:
>> On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:
>>
>> <[snip]
>>>
>>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>>>
>> No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
>> licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.
>
> Plus the stimulator+android lash-up would have to go through all the FDA
> approval process(es) again.

Yep - that's also a lengthy and expensive process.

My assumption: since iPhones are more common in US, the company decided
to go with an iOS version but does not want to spend the money for the
"poor" Android users who can not afford an iPhone.

--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de

In comp.mobile.android, on Fri, 8 Nov 2024 07:22:31 +0000 (GMT), Dave
Royal <dave@dave123royal.com> wrote:

>micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> Wrote in message:
>
>> In comp.mobile.android, on 7 Nov 2024 14:43:45 GMT, Allodoxaphobia
>> <trepidation@example.net> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed, 6 Nov 2024 17:54:08 -0000 (UTC), Dave Royal wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 06 Nov 2024 12:10:50 -0500, micky wrote:
>>>>
>>>><[snip]
>>>>>
>>>>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>>>>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>>>>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>>>>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>>>>>
>>>> No idea - depends on all sorts of things, including contractual and
>>>> licensing. Somewhere between 'not easy' and 'very hard' at a guess.
>>>
>>>Plus the stimulator+android lash-up would have to go through all the FDA
>>>approval process(es) again.
>>
>> Good point. I always (well, since they came out with them) thought
>> there are more android than iphones** because they are so much???
>> cheaper and just as good, but a friend tells me there are a lot more
>> iphones.
>
>Last time I investigated there were far more Android phones
> worldwide. In the US, which had the highest proportion of
> iPhones, it was about 50/50 with Android. More significant,
> perhaps, is that I bet iPhones predominate among those who can
> access this sort of medical treatment.
>
>I wonder if the FDA have to re-approve each new release if the
> app? If so it might be expensive for the supplier to resubmit all
> the tests. Probably depends on whether the app is deemed 'safety
> critical' - i.e. could it kill you?

Makes sense. Even if you don't have a phone, there is a remote control
that adjusts how strong and what "plan" the signals are. I don't know
what the app does that the phone doesn't do.

I have medicare and a supplemental plan (UHC/AARP**) that lets me go to
any doctor and doesn't require a referral to see a specialist. It's
pretty expensive, I think, but I haven't compared any other plan. This
spinal cord stimulator is covered by Medicare, and I could easily have
gotten referred to this guy my GP (an internist actually) so people even
with inferior supplemental plans are probably covered, but also maybe
many just tend to bear heir pains and don't think of going to a
specialist or getting fancy treaments. Maybe.

**Even though afaict AARP does nothing but good stuff, it sort of annoys
me by saying they "represent" old people, when we don't vote on what we
want or who does it. But I had to make up my mind -- I'd already lost
one month when I turned 65 -- and I figured they wouldn't lend their
name to a really bad plan. AARP dues are cheap, but I found I don't
even have to belong to AARP to have their insurance. Maybe the first
year I had to.

In comp.mobile.android, on Fri, 8 Nov 2024 09:17:18 +0100, Arno Welzel
<usenet@arnowelzel.de> wrote:

>micky, 2024-11-06 18:10:
>
>[...]
>> How hard can it be to write an Android version of an iphone app? Is the
>
>It depends on what the app does. There is no simple answer like "it will
>take x days".
>
>> connection protocol with the stimulator inside me different? Would the
>> stimulator have to be changed too, or would Android phones communicate
>> with other devices using the same protocol that iPhones do?
>
>Everything(!) is different. Depending on how they developed the app, it
>would be neccessary to use Kotlin or Java instead of Swift. It's also
>not very likely, that the app is using a cross platform framework like
>Capacitor with Angular - because then they would already have an app for
>Android devices too.
>
>> Even if a separate style stimulator would also be needed, how hard is it
>> to modify the programs to work on an Android phone. It sounds simple to
>
>As explained above: everthing is different, not just the brand of the phone.
>
>> me. In PC language, only the drivers would have to be changed, because
>
>No, there are no "drivers". The app uses Bluetooth to communicate with
>the device. An Android version would "just" have to implement the same
>features - but with a completely different programming language on an
>operating system which is based on Linux und Android instead of iOS.
>
>It is like porting a native Windows application to MacOS or Linux - this
>is also not an easy task, if you did not use cross platform tools like
>Qt or Electron.
>
>> they interface between the software and the hardware. Isnt' it already
>> well known what changes need to be made in iphone vs. android drivers?
>> (There is a remote control that they probably intend for me to use, but
>> the app does much more.)
>
>Even if the creators would know what to do - someone has to pay that.
>And I would not expect much less than at least 50000-100000 USD for that
>(2-3 months of development and testing for around 1500 USD per day -
>minimum).

You've also convinced me. No wonder they didn't hire me as Software
Development Director.