In article <1r4ud12ymj011.dlg@v.nguard.lh>, V@nguard.LH says...
>
> Jim the Geordie <jim@jimXscott.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Where in the world are you that waiters don't have hand held card
> > scanners.
> > Do you really allow a waiter to wander out of your site with your
> > debit/credit card?
>
> Haven't eaten out much, have you. The vast majority of restaurants I
> visit bring you a padded wallet with the tab sheet inside. You put your
> card in the wallet. The waiter comes back from there terminal with the
> actual bill inside the wallet (2 copies: 1 for restaurant, 1 for your
> copy). The bill has already been registered at their terminal, but you
> still need to add a tip, and sign the bill.
>
> I'm talking about restaurants where you're sitting at tables, and a
> waiter comes to the table. Not fast food joints where you walk up to
> counter to place an order, and wait until the food shows up in a bag. I
> haven't been to fast food joint in decades. I got sick afterward. Even
> when traveling, I look for a restaurant than visit some drive-up crap
> food joint. Might as well grab a stale sandwich and past-due milk at
> the gas shop when refueling.
>
> Haven't you ever eaten at a non-fast food restaurant, or elsewhere than,
> say, a buffet where you grab the food with a cash register is at the end
> of the line to total up your picks? Some restaurants have waiters that
> have readers to use your phone, but that is definitely not the norm
> here. In fact, it happens so rarely that I'd be surprised the waiter
> had a reader to use with my phone. I get seated, wait to order, order,
> wait for the food, eat the food, the waiter brings over a wallet with
> the summary tab when I'm done eating, I put the card in the wallet, they
> pickup the wallet to ring up the sale at their terminal, and bring back
> the bill for me to add a tip and to sign.
>
> Stop eating crap at the fast food or buffet joints. Start going to real
> restaurants. Then you'll have experience as to which ones have waiters
> with readers, and which have you give them a card. In my region, the
> card is the norm method of payment. In fact, I could wave my phone all
> over in the air, but no one brings a reader to my table.

You are clearly not eating out in England.
I am surprised that you have not had your card cloned by now.

--
Jim the Geordie

On 05.05.24 10:56, Jim the Geordie wrote:
> In article <1r4ud12ymj011.dlg@v.nguard.lh>, V@nguard.LH says...
>>
>> Jim the Geordie <jim@jimXscott.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> Where in the world are you that waiters don't have hand held card
>>> scanners.
>>> Do you really allow a waiter to wander out of your site with your
>>> debit/credit card?
>>
>> Haven't eaten out much, have you. The vast majority of restaurants I
>> visit bring you a padded wallet with the tab sheet inside. You put your
>> card in the wallet. The waiter comes back from there terminal with the
>> actual bill inside the wallet (2 copies: 1 for restaurant, 1 for your
>> copy). The bill has already been registered at their terminal, but you
>> still need to add a tip, and sign the bill.
>>
>> I'm talking about restaurants where you're sitting at tables, and a
>> waiter comes to the table. Not fast food joints where you walk up to
>> counter to place an order, and wait until the food shows up in a bag. I
>> haven't been to fast food joint in decades. I got sick afterward. Even
>> when traveling, I look for a restaurant than visit some drive-up crap
>> food joint. Might as well grab a stale sandwich and past-due milk at
>> the gas shop when refueling.
>>
>> Haven't you ever eaten at a non-fast food restaurant, or elsewhere than,
>> say, a buffet where you grab the food with a cash register is at the end
>> of the line to total up your picks? Some restaurants have waiters that
>> have readers to use your phone, but that is definitely not the norm
>> here. In fact, it happens so rarely that I'd be surprised the waiter
>> had a reader to use with my phone. I get seated, wait to order, order,
>> wait for the food, eat the food, the waiter brings over a wallet with
>> the summary tab when I'm done eating, I put the card in the wallet, they
>> pickup the wallet to ring up the sale at their terminal, and bring back
>> the bill for me to add a tip and to sign.
>>
>> Stop eating crap at the fast food or buffet joints. Start going to real
>> restaurants. Then you'll have experience as to which ones have waiters
>> with readers, and which have you give them a card. In my region, the
>> card is the norm method of payment. In fact, I could wave my phone all
>> over in the air, but no one brings a reader to my table.
>
> You are clearly not eating out in England.
> I am surprised that you have not had your card cloned by now.

On the Continent the payment process in a restaurant never requires to
give away the credit or the debit card. Not even be touched by a service
person. Just hold it to the mobil terminal without any direct contact
or use the internal (chip) card reader with bigger amounts.

--
"Alea iacta est." (Julius Caesar)

On 4.5.24 9:51 pm, VanguardLH wrote:
> Do you really want to give your very expensive smartphone to a table
> jockey that doesn't tote around an NFC reader, but has to walk to a
> terminal to register the transaction?

No - but that has never happened to me anywhere in the UK, they always
bring the reader to the table. They don't have a choice anyway - I
always pay with my smartwatch.

--
Tetbury, Gloucestershire , UK

On 5.5.24 3:54 am, VanguardLH wrote:
> Haven't eaten out much, have you.

Quite a lot, in my case.

> The vast majority of restaurants I
> visit bring you a padded wallet with the tab sheet inside. You put your
> card in the wallet. The waiter comes back from there terminal with the
> actual bill inside the wallet (2 copies: 1 for restaurant, 1 for your
> copy). The bill has already been registered at their terminal, but you
> still need to add a tip, and sign the bill.

The waiter, in every single pub and more up market restaurant I've been
in for many years, brings the reader to me. I haven't signed a bill for
umpteen years. I don't put my card in any folders nor let it out of my
sight - if I even have it with me. The Italian (and many other
economies) depended on mugs letting them take their cards out of their
owner's sight - but nearly all of Europe now brings the reader to me. In
cafés, etc I sometimes pay at the counter with my smart watch.

--
Tetbury, Gloucestershire , UK

On 5.5.24 4:35 am, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 5/4/24 7:54 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
>> J The bill has already been registered at their terminal, but you
>> still need to add a tip, and sign the bill.
>
> I always tip in cash. It's not MY job to help the IRS.
>

I'm inclined to use cash for tips too. If you add it to a credit card
payment it usually ends up in the hands of the owner, not the staff who
looked after me. However, that is becoming a thing of the past now in
the UK - more and more places add a hefty service charge to the bill, so
I certainly don't leave any tips then. I consider this tantamount to
fraud and won't go back to restaurants that do it - but eventually I'll
have nowhere left to go if I refuse all service charges. We should
campaign for the law to change to force all businesses to include ALL
charges in the prices quoted for their goods and to pay their staff a
fair amount in the first place.

--
Tetbury, Gloucestershire , UK

In article <v17kge$1p9gh$2@dont-email.me>, bob.henson@outlook.com
says...
>
> On 5.5.24 4:35 am, The Real Bev wrote:
> > On 5/4/24 7:54 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
> >> J The bill has already been registered at their terminal, but you
> >> still need to add a tip, and sign the bill.
> >
> > I always tip in cash. It's not MY job to help the IRS.
> >
>
> I'm inclined to use cash for tips too. If you add it to a credit card
> payment it usually ends up in the hands of the owner, not the staff who
> looked after me. However, that is becoming a thing of the past now in
> the UK - more and more places add a hefty service charge to the bill, so
> I certainly don't leave any tips then. I consider this tantamount to
> fraud and won't go back to restaurants that do it - but eventually I'll
> have nowhere left to go if I refuse all service charges. We should
> campaign for the law to change to force all businesses to include ALL
> charges in the prices quoted for their goods and to pay their staff a
> fair amount in the first place.

Agreed. I sometimes ask the waiter how their system works i.e. do they
keep their own tips, share amongst the staff (including kitcen staff) or
does the owner get it?
If it goes through the card, the provider will receive a percentage if
the tip.
I'm not sure what century VanguardLH lives in, but taxis, my window
cleaner and the local ice-cream van all have card resders, but of course
they all prefer cash.

--
Jim the Geordie

VanguardLH, 2024-05-04 22:51:

> Do you really want to give your very expensive smartphone to a table
> jockey that doesn't tote around an NFC reader, but has to walk to a
> terminal to register the transaction? When a waiter comes to my table
> for me to pay my tab, he has no means of using my phone at the table.
> Many restaurants do not have a front desk where you pay for your meal.
> You're expected to pay before you leave the table. The waiters use
> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.

Well, this depends on where you live. Here in Berlin, Germany, many
restaurants either expect cash or if you can by with card, they usually
have hand-held readers since no guest would accept giving their card
away here or like to go to some front desk to pay.

And in many shops and supermarkets paying via NFC is become the standard
and the readers are position so that you can just use them without your
card, smartphone or smartwatch.

> I'd much prefer handing over a plastic card to a waiter who takes it to
> a terminal to enter the transaction than hand them my phone with the
[...]

And I'd prefer *not* to give my cards to *anyone* to pay. Is it really
the norm in the US to give anyone your credit cards, so other people
could do whatever they want with it?

> What about the contractor that, say, cuts down a tree, and wants to be
> paid? He has his phone, but can your mobile pay app using NFC connect
> to his mobile pay app via NFC on his phone? I've seen many SOHO folks
[...]

Well - this is something you have to discuss *before* you contract
someone. But to answer your question: no, apps like Google Wallet are
*not* designed to transfer money from one phone to another via NFC but
to "emulate" a credit card. So if the contractor has a mobile NFC
terminal like SumUp, he can accept payments this way as well:

<https://www.sumup.com/en-us/card-reader-comparison/>

> I see mobile pay apps as convenient only when they are so. That they
> exist doesn't mean those apps are the most convenient payment method.
> Many users don't leave their phones on in trying to preserve battery
> power for when they do want to use their phones. Oh joy, wait to power
[...]

I don't. I charge my phone (at the moment it's a Google Pixel 6a) once a
day and usually have no problem using it until the whole day until I go
to bed.

> Do the mobile pay apps run as a service? If not, how long does it take
> to load them? No, not refocus to a backgrounded app, but to load the
> app, and then select which card to charge? Android leaves apps

At least the apps register to handle NFC events, so they react more or
less instantly as soon as you put the phone near a NFC card reader. For
security reasons you usually have to turn on the display at least and if
the amount to be paid is above a certain limit you also have to unlock
your phone as well.

[...]
> I always have my wallet on me. It's in my pants pocket when I put on my
> pants, or I transfer the wallet and other goodies to a clean pair. My
> phone might be with me, might not. I too often forget to take my phone

And my phone is always with me since it is more important in my daily
life than my wallet.

> with me. Also, just because I have the phone doesn't mean it happens to
> be fully charged. I've been out with my phone when it makes the dreaded
> "battery low" alert, or I find it auto-powered off when the battery
> level got too low. Phones are nowhere near as reliable as cards. Go
[...]

That's because your phone is not as important for you in daily life. I
have a password manager on the phone, e-mail, Signal messenger, Netdata
alerts and so on. And yes, this is crucial for my job as IT tech lead in
a big company.

> I have both manual tools, and those that are battery powered, like a
> hand screwdriver and a cordless power drill. I use both. Even when the
> powered drill is charged and immediately at hand, sometimes a manual
> screwdriver is the better choice. Take both the phone and card with

Yes, manual screwdrivers are often the better choice if you do *not*
want to strip tight screws or if you want to tighten them without stripping.

> you. Use whichever is most convenient at the time, and whichever will
> work at the time. Sometimes either will work. Sometimes only one
> works. Sometimes neither will work (shit happens).

Of course - everybody has the free choice to use whatever works best.
But mobile payment using apps like Google Wallet has become the norm for
many people.
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de

Jörg Lorenz, 2024-05-04 16:46:

> On 04.05.24 01:29, Jim the Geordie wrote:
>> Any preferences here - and why?
>
> I do not use any of them and I also do not use Apple Pay.

Apple is off-topic here.

> 1) I do not see any added value
> 2) I do not want tech companies in the financial sector in any way

Why do you use a payment app then at all?

--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de

VanguardLH <V@nguard.lh> wrote:
> Jim the Geordie <jim@jimXscott.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Where in the world are you that waiters don't have hand held card
> > scanners.
> > Do you really allow a waiter to wander out of your site with your
> > debit/credit card?
>
> Haven't eaten out much, have you.

When in doubt - as you *should* have been -, don't act like an
obnoxious pompous twat.

> The vast majority of restaurants I
> visit bring you a padded wallet with the tab sheet inside. You put your
> card in the wallet. The waiter comes back from there terminal with the
> actual bill inside the wallet (2 copies: 1 for restaurant, 1 for your
> copy). The bill has already been registered at their terminal, but you
> still need to add a tip, and sign the bill.

Note Jim's TLD. Unlike you, he doesn't live in the US, but in a
country where - like in most of the 'western' world - they have modern
payment systems. The waiter brings the payment 'terminal' - mostly a
small, phone-like, handheld device - to your table. And that payment
terminal handles cards, phones and (AFAIK) watches. Probably only in
some very posh restaurants it's still somewhat common to take your card
to their payment terminal.

But indeed what you describe is common in the US, they take your card
to their payment terminal. Mind-boggling for us non-USAsians, but when
we're there, we just go with the flow. :-)

[More rather/very offensive assumptions deleted.]

The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 5/4/24 1:03 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
> > On 5/4/24 3:31 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> >> On 2024-05-04 12:20, Bob Henson wrote:
> >>> On 4.5.24 10:06 am, Arno Welzel wrote:
> >>>> Jim the Geordie, 2024-05-04 01:29:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Any preferences here - and why?
> >>>>
> >>>> Samsung Wallet only works with Samsung devices but not on my ancient
> >>>> Samsung Gear S3 and probably also not because I am not based in US.
> >>>>
> >>>> So I use Google Wallet ("Google Pay" was renamed) which works fine and
> >>>> can even be used in newer smartwatches if they are based on WearOS like
> >>>> Ticwatch Pro 5.
> >>>
> >>> The ability to pay by smartwatch is very handy - I use it nearly all the
> >>> time. It has an additional advantage - when paying bills to young
> >>> counter assistants or waiters, they can't believe that an old geezer of
> >>> 80 can understand the technology when they frequently struggle with it.
> >>> I like to score the odd point for the old folk when I can <grin>
> >
> > Hrm. The youngsters need to be reminded that their grandparents
> > INVENTED computers.
> >
> >> Heh. You have convinced me :-D
> >
> > Little point in trying to educate the stupid
>
> Not you, the youngsters!

But, for most of us, he (Carlos) *is* a youngster! :-)

On 2024-05-04 21:49, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 5/4/24 1:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> On 2024-05-04 06:01, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 5/3/24 4:29 PM, Jim the Geordie wrote:
>>>> Any preferences here - and why?
>>>
>>> I have often wondered about the value of any of these.  What's wrong
>>> with a credit card which gives you a rebate?
>>
>> No rebate here.
>
> A free Citibank card gives 2% back on everything.  A free US Bank card
> gives 5% back on ut8lities.  I don't see how tapping/sliding the card on
> the machine could be any more difficult than <whatever-pay/wallet>.

It is easier when the phone is already in your hand. Probably I have
already used the phone to get the supermarket application for rebates
and things.

Close the phone, and get out my purse from my pocket? Slower.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2024-05-04 22:06, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 5/4/24 6:31 AM, Newyana2 wrote:
>> On 5/4/2024 12:01 AM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 5/3/24 4:29 PM, Jim the Geordie wrote:
>>>> Any preferences here - and why?
>>>
>>> I have often wondered about the value of any of these.  What's wrong
>>> with a credit card which gives you a rebate?
>>
>>    I think it's just part of the cellphone ubiquity trend. People
>> don't want to have to leave their cellphone for anything.
>> For a non-cellphone-addict it's an awkward bottleneck to
>> use 3rd-party (spyware) pay services. For the average
>> cellphone addict (90+% of people) it seems like a brilliant
>> idea to just set up one e-servant to handle all of your
>> transactions and paperwork.
>
> So you pay the bill to the wallet entity rather than the credit card
> entity?  What if you use different cards at different stores/functions?

No bills.
You can have several cards in Google Wallet.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2024-05-05 16:15, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 5/4/24 1:03 PM, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> On 5/4/24 3:31 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>>> On 2024-05-04 12:20, Bob Henson wrote:
>>>>> On 4.5.24 10:06 am, Arno Welzel wrote:
>>>>>> Jim the Geordie, 2024-05-04 01:29:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any preferences here - and why?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Samsung Wallet only works with Samsung devices but not on my ancient
>>>>>> Samsung Gear S3 and probably also not because I am not based in US.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So I use Google Wallet ("Google Pay" was renamed) which works fine and
>>>>>> can even be used in newer smartwatches if they are based on WearOS like
>>>>>> Ticwatch Pro 5.
>>>>>
>>>>> The ability to pay by smartwatch is very handy - I use it nearly all the
>>>>> time. It has an additional advantage - when paying bills to young
>>>>> counter assistants or waiters, they can't believe that an old geezer of
>>>>> 80 can understand the technology when they frequently struggle with it.
>>>>> I like to score the odd point for the old folk when I can <grin>
>>>
>>> Hrm. The youngsters need to be reminded that their grandparents
>>> INVENTED computers.
>>>
>>>> Heh. You have convinced me :-D
>>>
>>> Little point in trying to educate the stupid
>>
>> Not you, the youngsters!
>
> But, for most of us, he (Carlos) *is* a youngster! :-)

{chuckle} :-)

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2024-05-04 22:51, VanguardLH wrote:
> Do you really want to give your very expensive smartphone to a table
> jockey that doesn't tote around an NFC reader, but has to walk to a
> terminal to register the transaction? When a waiter comes to my table
> for me to pay my tab, he has no means of using my phone at the table.
> Many restaurants do not have a front desk where you pay for your meal.
> You're expected to pay before you leave the table. The waiters use
> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.

You live in a backwards country.

The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
like them taking our card out of sight to the office.

....

>
> What about the contractor that, say, cuts down a tree, and wants to be
> paid? He has his phone, but can your mobile pay app using NFC connect
> to his mobile pay app via NFC on his phone? I've seen many SOHO folks
> that plug in a USB card reader into their phone, and that's how they get
> paid by sliding your card through their card reader attached to their
> phone. I've even had contractors that don't even have the USB card
> reader. They have to manually write down the credit card number, CVV,
> and expiration date onto an invoice that you sign. Wave the phone all
> over the invoice paper, but it ain't gonna work.

I pay by Bizum, phone to phone. No contact.

>
> I see mobile pay apps as convenient only when they are so. That they
> exist doesn't mean those apps are the most convenient payment method.
> Many users don't leave their phones on in trying to preserve battery

I never met one such.

....

>
> Do the mobile pay apps run as a service? If not, how long does it take
> to load them?

instant.

Battery never fails me.

....

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2024-05-04 12:31, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2024-05-04 12:20, Bob Henson wrote:
>> On 4.5.24 10:06 am, Arno Welzel wrote:
>>> Jim the Geordie, 2024-05-04 01:29:
>>>
>>>> Any preferences here - and why?
>>>
>>> Samsung Wallet only works with Samsung devices but not on my ancient
>>> Samsung Gear S3 and probably also not because I am not based in US.
>>>
>>> So I use Google Wallet ("Google Pay" was renamed) which works fine and
>>> can even be used in newer smartwatches if they are based on WearOS like
>>> Ticwatch Pro 5.
>>>
>>
>> The ability to pay by smartwatch is very handy - I use it nearly all
>> the time. It has an additional advantage - when paying bills to young
>> counter assistants or waiters, they can't believe that an old geezer
>> of 80 can understand the technology when they frequently struggle with
>> it. I like to score the odd point for the old folk when I can <grin>
>
> Heh. You have convinced me :-D
>

I tried to activate the feature in my fitbit charge 6. At the last step
it failed and said to contact my bank. :-(

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 05.05.24 15:53, Arno Welzel wrote:
> Jörg Lorenz, 2024-05-04 16:46:
>
>> On 04.05.24 01:29, Jim the Geordie wrote:
>>> Any preferences here - and why?
>>
>> I do not use any of them and I also do not use Apple Pay.
>
> Apple is off-topic here.

It is very much on topic in this context. Are you trying to be
destructive at any price?

>> 1) I do not see any added value
>> 2) I do not want tech companies in the financial sector in any way
>
> Why do you use a payment app then at all?

You are not able to reflect on what I wrote. Credit Card and Debit Card
companies as well as banks and other institutions are regulated and
watched. Tech companies are not. They are just an additional risk to the
system.

But these are categories that are beyond your knowledge as you proved in
the German-speaking groups to a great extent and your question proves it
as well.

--
"Manus manum lavat."

VanguardLH <V@nguard.lh> wrote:

[Most other points already covered by Arno.]

> What about the contractor that, say, cuts down a tree, and wants to be
> paid? He has his phone, but can your mobile pay app using NFC connect
> to his mobile pay app via NFC on his phone?

In our country (The Netherlands) and probably in most of Europe and
the rest of the 'western' (and other?) world, we have several
person-to-person payment systems, which also work on smartphones.

One system is phonenumber-to-phonenumber, so you only need the
contractor's phonenumber, which you probably already have. Another one
is a 'tikkie' (tap on the shoulder), where the contractor's bank app
sends a payment request (normally via WhatsApp) and you pay via your
bank app.

So no NFC, and no USB card readers required.

[...]

On 5/5/24 5:14 AM, Jim the Geordie wrote:
> bob.henson@outlook.com says...
>> On 5.5.24 4:35 am, The Real Bev wrote:
>> >
>> > I always tip in cash. It's not MY job to help the IRS.
>>
>> I'm inclined to use cash for tips too.
>
> I'm not sure what century VanguardLH lives in, but taxis, my window
> cleaner and the local ice-cream van all have card resders, but of course
> they all prefer cash.

If you ask a small businessperson "Do you give cash discounts?" the
answer is generally yes.

--
Cheers, Bev
...so few snipers, so many politicians...

On 5/5/24 7:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:

>> You're expected to pay before you leave the table. The waiters use
>> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.
>
> You live in a backwards country.
>
> The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
> like them taking our card out of sight to the office.

Perhaps we're just more trusting of our fellow man. Or perhaps
Americans are more trustworthy than Europeans.

<fight starts>

--
Cheers, Bev
...so few snipers, so many politicians...

On 05.05.24 20:06, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 5/5/24 7:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>
>>> You're expected to pay before you leave the table. The waiters use
>>> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.
>>
>> You live in a backwards country.
>>
>> The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
>> like them taking our card out of sight to the office.
>
> Perhaps we're just more trusting of our fellow man. Or perhaps
> Americans are more trustworthy than Europeans.
>
> <fight starts>

The fight is already over. For security reasons the credit card
companies allow only transactions with a security PIN and card readers.
That started in Europe IIRC around the year 2014.

--
"Alea iacta est." (Julius Caesar)

On 2024-05-05 20:06, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 5/5/24 7:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>
>>> You're expected to pay before you leave the table.  The waiters use
>>> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.
>>
>> You live in a backwards country.
>>
>> The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
>> like them taking our card out of sight to the office.
>
> Perhaps we're just more trusting of our fellow man.  Or perhaps
> Americans are more trustworthy than Europeans.
>
> <fight starts>

We don't take our guns to the restaurant :-p

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 06.05.24 08:07, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2024-05-05 20:06, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 5/5/24 7:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>
>>>> You're expected to pay before you leave the table.  The waiters use
>>>> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.
>>>
>>> You live in a backwards country.
>>>
>>> The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
>>> like them taking our card out of sight to the office.
>>
>> Perhaps we're just more trusting of our fellow man.  Or perhaps
>> Americans are more trustworthy than Europeans.
>>
>> <fight starts>
>
> We don't take our guns to the restaurant :-p

But our credit cards. ;-)

--
"Alea iacta est." (Julius Caesar)

On 5.5.24 7:06 pm, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 5/5/24 7:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>
>>> You're expected to pay before you leave the table. The waiters use
>>> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.
>>
>> You live in a backwards country.
>>
>> The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
>> like them taking our card out of sight to the office.
>
> Perhaps we're just more trusting of our fellow man. Or perhaps
> Americans are more trustworthy than Europeans.
>
> <fight starts>
>
>
Neither - you're just behind the times. :-)

--
Tetbury, Gloucestershire , UK

Arno Welzel, 2024-05-05 15:50:

[...]> And in many shops and supermarkets paying via NFC is become the
standard
> and the readers are position so that you can just use them without your
> card, smartphone or smartwatch.

Well - this should read as "without handing over your card, smartphone
or smartwatch to the cashier" of course...

--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de

The Real Bev, 2024-05-05 20:06:

> On 5/5/24 7:22 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>
>>> You're expected to pay before you leave the table. The waiters use
>>> terminals to enter the transaction, not hand-held readers.
>>
>> You live in a backwards country.
>>
>> The waiter comes to my table with a wireless pad or gadget. We do not
>> like them taking our card out of sight to the office.
>
> Perhaps we're just more trusting of our fellow man. Or perhaps
> Americans are more trustworthy than Europeans.

I think in the US many people usally just have more than one credit card
and the consequences of a credit card fraud are not as severe as in many
European countries.

--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de