"Make them pay their fair share!"

She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.

All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us first.

On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
> "Make them pay their fair share!"

And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
share" is, it is usually under what they are already
paying.

This is just Fascist/Communist envy politics.

> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>
> All business owners pay taxes.  We have to or the IRS comes after us first.

And does the public realize that ultimately business
taxes are passed on to their customer? It is a way
of taxing the populace without it appearing on their
tax bill.

On 9/30/2024 4:40 AM, T wrote:
> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>
> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
> paying.
>
> This is just Fascist/Communist envy politics.
>
>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>
>> All business owners pay taxes.  We have to or the IRS comes after us
>> first.
>
>
> And does the public realize that ultimately business
> taxes are passed on to their customer?  It is a way
> of taxing the populace without it appearing on their
> tax bill.

It is simple, increase corporate tax and corporations take business and
profits off shore where taxes are less.

me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:

> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>
> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>
> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
> first.
>

And yet they haven't been paying their taxes, and the IRS has been so short
funded they couldn't go after anyone.

T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:

> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>
> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
> paying.
>
No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
their income than a billionaire.

Frank <"frank "@frank.net> wrote in news:vde0gd$274ne$1@dont-email.me:

> On 9/30/2024 4:40 AM, T wrote:
>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>
>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>> paying.
>>
>> This is just Fascist/Communist envy politics.
>>
>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>
>>> All business owners pay taxes.  We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>> first.
>>
>>
>> And does the public realize that ultimately business
>> taxes are passed on to their customer?  It is a way
>> of taxing the populace without it appearing on their
>> tax bill.
>
> It is simple, increase corporate tax and corporations take business and
> profits off shore where taxes are less.
>

And where would that be? China?

"Frank" <"frank "@frank.net> wrote in message
news:vde0gd$274ne$1@dont-email.me...
> On 9/30/2024 4:40 AM, T wrote:
>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>
>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>> paying.
>>
>> This is just Fascist/Communist envy politics.
>>
>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>
>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>> first.
>>
>>
>> And does the public realize that ultimately business
>> taxes are passed on to their customer? It is a way
>> of taxing the populace without it appearing on their
>> tax bill.
>
> It is simple, increase corporate tax and corporations take business and
> profits off shore where taxes are less.

Yes, when corporate taxes are high enough to make the expense of such a move
worth it, they will.

In the end thought the people play all corporate taxes and then some to the
corporations for being the 'bad guy'.

That's why corporations announce record profits when their taxes are
increased.

They pay the taxes from the gross profit, which lowers net profit so they
raise prices to return gross profit to what it was and a bit more to bring
net profits back to the percentage of gross profits that the company has
found to be best.

Thus corporate taxes are imposed -> pricing increases + extra to bring net
profits back up -> and corporations become even more profitable

The only ones hurt are the American consumer who finds prices increases
and/or amount being sold reduced

[Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:

>me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>
>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>
>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>
>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>> first.
>>
>
>And yet they haven't been paying their taxes

Bullshit. The rich pay most of the taxes.

[Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:

>T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>
>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>
>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>> paying.
>>
>No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
>their income than a billionaire.

They STILL pay less in taxes

Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>
>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>> paying.
>>>
>> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
>> their income than a billionaire.
>
> They STILL pay less in taxes
>
native canadians don't pay taxes

"Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
news:vdedad$29778$1@dont-email.me...
> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>
>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>
>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>
>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>> first.
>>
>
> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes,

They why aren't they being arrested for tax evasion?

> and the IRS has been so short
> funded they couldn't go after anyone.

So they have fired all the auditors?

"Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
news:vdedjd$29778$3@dont-email.me...
> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>
>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>
>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>> paying.
>>
> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
> their income than a billionaire.

Cite

Then show us that the billionaire owed more in income tax and why they
weren't charged and convicted of tax evasion.

"Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
news:vdedlm$29778$4@dont-email.me...
> Frank <"frank "@frank.net> wrote in news:vde0gd$274ne$1@dont-email.me:
>
>> On 9/30/2024 4:40 AM, T wrote:
>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>> paying.
>>>
>>> This is just Fascist/Communist envy politics.
>>>
>>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>>
>>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>>> first.
>>>
>>>
>>> And does the public realize that ultimately business
>>> taxes are passed on to their customer? It is a way
>>> of taxing the populace without it appearing on their
>>> tax bill.
>>
>> It is simple, increase corporate tax and corporations take business and
>> profits off shore where taxes are less.
>>
>
> And where would that be? China?

Ireland is a popular choice certainly Apple thought so shifting some $300
Billion there to take advantage of their much lower tax rates. Other
companies that have done much the same shifting assets and income to places
with lower tax rates. Often termed "tax havens"

China, really isn't deemed a tax haven particularly given the government
there.

On 9/30/2024 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>
>> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>>
>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>
>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>> first.
>>>
>>
>> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes
>
> Bullshit. The rich pay most of the taxes.

They should pay the largest portion as they have the largest portion of
the money

https://www.oxfamamerica.org/explore/stories/do-the-rich-pay-their-fair-share/

According to a 2021 White House study, the wealthiest 400 billionaire
families in the U.S. paid an average federal individual tax rate of just
8.2 percent. For comparison, the average American taxpayer in the same
year paid 13 percent.

On 9/30/2024 1:21 PM, Scout wrote:
>
>
> "Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
> news:vdedjd$29778$3@dont-email.me...
>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>> paying.
>>>
>> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
>> their income than a billionaire.
>
> Cite
>

>
>
>

https://www.oxfamamerica.org/explore/stories/do-the-rich-pay-their-fair-share/

According to a 2021 White House study, the wealthiest 400 billionaire
families in the U.S. paid an average federal individual tax rate of just
8.2 percent. For comparison, the average American taxpayer in the same
year paid 13 percent.

[Default] Ed P <esp@snet.n> typed:

>On 9/30/2024 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>>
>>> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>>>
>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>
>>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>>
>>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>>> first.
>>>>
>>>
>>> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes
>>
>> Bullshit. The rich pay most of the taxes.
>
>
>They should pay the largest portion as they have the largest portion of
>the money

No. Everyone should pay the same.

"Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote in
news:vdeh4t$29ret$3@dont-email.me:

>
>
> "Frank" <"frank "@frank.net> wrote in message
> news:vde0gd$274ne$1@dont-email.me...
>> On 9/30/2024 4:40 AM, T wrote:
>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>> paying.
>>>
>>> This is just Fascist/Communist envy politics.
>>>
>>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you
>>>> are.
>>>>
>>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after
>>>> us first.
>>>
>>>
>>> And does the public realize that ultimately business
>>> taxes are passed on to their customer? It is a way
>>> of taxing the populace without it appearing on their
>>> tax bill.
>>
>> It is simple, increase corporate tax and corporations take business
>> and profits off shore where taxes are less.
>
> Yes, when corporate taxes are high enough to make the expense of such
> a move worth it, they will.
>
Yet when taxes were high (93%) those corporations stayed here and
invested in the US. It's when the taxes were lowered that they quit here
and went to other countries.

On 9/30/2024 2:18 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
> [Default] Ed P <esp@snet.n> typed:
>
>> On 9/30/2024 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>>>
>>>> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>>>>
>>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>>
>>>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>>>
>>>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>>>> first.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes
>>>
>>> Bullshit. The rich pay most of the taxes.
>>
>>
>> They should pay the largest portion as they have the largest portion of
>> the money
>
> No. Everyone should pay the same.

Correct. You are not interpreting that correctly.

If I make $10,000 and pay $100 in taxes do you think a billionaire
should pay the same $100?

No, but they should be paying the same percentage. They have more
money, this they pay more in whole dollars but are paying less as a
percentage of their income.

Ed P wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On 9/30/2024 2:18 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> [Default] Ed P <esp@snet.n> typed:
>>
>>> On 9/30/2024 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>>>>
>>>>> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>>>>>
>>>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>>>>> first.
>>>>>
>>>>> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. The rich pay most of the taxes.
>>>
>>> They should pay the largest portion as they have the largest portion of
>>> the money
>>
>> No. Everyone should pay the same.
>
> Correct. You are not interpreting that correctly.
>
> If I make $10,000 and pay $100 in taxes do you think a billionaire
> should pay the same $100?
>
> No, but they should be paying the same percentage. They have more
> money, this they pay more in whole dollars but are paying less as a
> percentage of their income.

They get to hide a lot of income in various tax shelters.

A more nuanced view for the prickly poster "Klaus":

https://itep.org/who-pays-taxes-in-america-in-2019/

--
If you haven't enjoyed the material in the last few lectures then a career
in chartered accountancy beckons.
-- Advice from the lecturer in the middle of the Stochastic
Systems course.

[Default] Ed P <esp@snet.n> typed:

>On 9/30/2024 2:18 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> [Default] Ed P <esp@snet.n> typed:
>>
>>> On 9/30/2024 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>>>> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>>>>
>>>>> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>>>>>
>>>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All business owners pay taxes. We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>>>>> first.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. The rich pay most of the taxes.
>>>
>>>
>>> They should pay the largest portion as they have the largest portion of
>>> the money
>>
>> No. Everyone should pay the same.
>
>Correct. You are not interpreting that correctly.
>
>If I make $10,000 and pay $100 in taxes do you think a billionaire
>should pay the same $100?

Good boy!

On 9/30/24 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
> [Default] Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>
>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>> paying.
>>>
>> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
>> their income than a billionaire.
>
> They STILL pay less in taxes

True, but that's being a tad dishonest in avoiding the stated point.

That point was "fair share". Its metric was "percentage of income",
which is very consistent with how this topic is discussed.

So instead of ignoring the point in the context made, could you please
try addressing the point that they were making?

Because deflection attempts make you sound like you know that their
point is true, and you aren't even honest enough to acknowledge it.

-hh

On 9/30/24 1:43 PM, Ed P wrote:
> On 9/30/2024 1:21 PM, Scout wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
>> news:vdedjd$29778$3@dont-email.me...
>>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>>>
>>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>
>>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>>> paying.
>>>>
>>> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
>>> their income than a billionaire.
>>
>> Cite
>>
>
>>
>>
>>
>
> https://www.oxfamamerica.org/explore/stories/do-the-rich-pay-their-fair-
> share/
>
> According to a 2021 White House study, the wealthiest 400 billionaire
> families in the U.S. paid an average federal individual tax rate of just
> 8.2 percent. For comparison, the average American taxpayer in the same
> year paid 13 percent.

Predictable counterpoint attempt:
"but that's not showing us that it was *illegal*!".

But what it doesn't do is to acknowledge that such outcomes are an
outcome of lobbying power to change the laws to favor them, and how the
tax code has provisions that benefit a few wealthy donors, at the
general expense of everyone else.

FWIW, a family member worked at one point for the IRS - their comment
was that it is technically illegal to have a section of tax code that
written specifically to benefit only one taxpayer ... and the workaround
that exists is to have intersecting qualification requirements where
several benefit from each section, and its only a "coincidence" that
only one person benefits from being perfectly positioned in the "BINGO"
overlap in the middle where all qualifications are met.

-hh

On 9/30/24 1:18 PM, Scout wrote:
>
>
> "Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
> news:vdedad$29778$1@dont-email.me...
>> me too <not@kamala.dunce> wrote in news:vddela$14gjp$1@news.mixmin.net:
>>
>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>
>>> She's either a stone cold liar or she's stupid and believes you are.
>>>
>>> All business owners pay taxes.  We have to or the IRS comes after us
>>> first.
>>>
>>
>> And yet they haven't been paying their taxes,
>
> They why aren't they being arrested for tax evasion?

It isn't necessarily a criminal act requiring incarceration.

>
>> and the IRS has been so short
>> funded they couldn't go after anyone.
>
> So they have fired all the auditors?

No, its been years of deliberate under funding of the Agency, usually
done by the GOP for their wealthy constituents. Fortunately, a recent
budget cycle restored some of those cuts.

As Baxter posted on this thread earlier:

[quote]
IRS says it has recovered $1.3 billion in unpaid taxes from rich
Americans. The IRS said Friday that it has recovered $1.3 billion in
unpaid taxes from high-income Americans who had either failed to file
their returns or who hadn't fully paid what they owed.

<https://www.cbsnews.com/news/irs-recovered-1-3-billion-unpaid-taxes-wealthy-taxpayers-audits/>

[/quote]

Likewise, my accountant told me this past spring that his telephone wait
times for his calls to the IRS were waaaaaay down this past year.

-hh

On 9/30/2024 2:38 PM, -hh wrote:
> On 9/30/24 1:08 PM, Klaus Schadenfreude wrote:
>> [Default]  Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> typed:
>>
>>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>>>
>>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>
>>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>>> paying.
>>>>
>>> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater percentage of
>>> their income than a billionaire.
>>
>> They STILL pay less in taxes
>
>
> True, but that's being a tad dishonest in avoiding the stated point.
>
> That point was "fair share".  Its metric was "percentage of income",
> which is very consistent with how this topic is discussed.

Yes we know you indexing/social class warriors are all about penance for
success.

The only literally fair tax is a low rate national flat tax, period.

> So instead of ignoring the point in the context made, could you please
> try addressing the point that they were making?

Could you just fuck the hell off and go back to lurking the PX?

> Because deflection attempts make you sound like you know that their
> point is true, and you aren't even honest enough to acknowledge it.
>
> -hh

Unable to secure a victory for "indexing" on any merits, real or
perceived, you lamely try to cast his unwillingness to micro-debate a
typical leftard taxing point.

You vermin are consummate hypocrites!

On 9/30/2024 2:43 PM, -hh wrote:
> On 9/30/24 1:43 PM, Ed P wrote:
>> On 9/30/2024 1:21 PM, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Baxter" <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote in message
>>> news:vdedjd$29778$3@dont-email.me...
>>>> T <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in news:vddo52$1u779$4@dont-email.me:
>>>>
>>>>> On 9/29/24 22:58, me too wrote:
>>>>>> "Make them pay their fair share!"
>>>>>
>>>>> And when the populace is asked what percentage that "fair
>>>>> share" is, it is usually under what they are already
>>>>> paying.
>>>>>
>>>> No, it's not - not when a teacher, or nurse pays a greater
>>>> percentage of
>>>> their income than a billionaire.
>>>
>>> Cite
>>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> https://www.oxfamamerica.org/explore/stories/do-the-rich-pay-their-fair- share/
>>
>> According to a 2021 White House study, the wealthiest 400 billionaire
>> families in the U.S. paid an average federal individual tax rate of
>> just 8.2 percent. For comparison, the average American taxpayer in the
>> same year paid 13 percent.
>
>
> Predictable counterpoint attempt:
> "but that's not showing us that it was *illegal*!".
>
> But what it doesn't do is to acknowledge that such outcomes are an
> outcome of lobbying power to change the laws to favor them, and how the
> tax code has provisions that benefit a few wealthy donors, at the
> general expense of everyone else.

Sort of like the electoral college benefits a few less populous states, eh?

> FWIW, a family member worked at one point for the IRS

< SMH - unsurprising familial deep statism...>

> - their comment
> was that it is technically illegal to have a section of tax code that
> written specifically to benefit only one taxpayer ... and the workaround

The entire IRS is a sham and a private corporation beholden to Yuro
banksters that must be abolished!

Learn, you fucking blood tick:

https://dn790003.ca.archive.org/0/items/pdfy--Pori1NL6fKm2SnY/The%20Creature%20From%20Jekyll%20Island.pdf

"A superb analysis deserving serious attention by all
Americans. Be prepared for one heck of a journey through time
and mind."
Ron Paul, member of Congress
House Banking Committee
"What every American needs to know about central bank
power. A gripping adventure into the secret world of the
international banking cartel."
Mark Thornton, Asst. Professor of Economics,
Auburn University; Coordinator Academic Affairs,
Ludwig von Mises Institute
"A magnificent accomplishment - a train-load of heavy history,
organized so well and written in such a relaxed and easy style
that it captivated me. I hated to put it down. "
Dan Smoot
Publisher/Editor, Dan Smoot Report
"As a career banker and president of a bank consulting firm, I
thought I had a good understanding of the Federal Reserve. But
this book changed the way I view our entire monetary system."
Marilyn MacGruder Barn wall
Grand Junction, Colorado