"Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:iekidjdd4jbilsjb1laqichh2hf2rmt6gg@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 4 Sep 2024 14:05:18 -0500, "Scout"
> <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>That's one I could NEVER understand.. how did Congress EVER get to the
>>point
>>that the laws they create for everyone else does NOT apply to them.
>
> LOL! Because you keep voting for them! Do it again! Vote for the
> investor
> class party one more time. Maybe it'll turn out different.

You don't have a clue of who I vote for. However Rudy is well known for
jumping to unfounded conclusions based on his bigoted assumptions.

Governor Swill wrote:
> social security

Governor Swill /Rudy Canoza/Lou Bricano/J Carlson/Michael A
Terrell/Chris Ahlstrom/Intelligent Party/Alan Bond/Bill Flett/kami and a
few dozen other socks wrote:

Multiple death threats against Trump:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <emo79jh20rlasuask9094vtlepuu5ui0av@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
<ONIkO.102541$dFU1.83026@fx11.ams4> <XnsB1AF52A9CDF3B629555@185.151.15.190>
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Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:38:43 -0400

Oh poor me I got shot at ...

Swill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <4ln79j914cpespbrssonesbciii33ess3m@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
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Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:37:51 -0400

Cheer up, maybe someone else will try.

Swill

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: J Carlson <j_carlson@gmx.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.politics.immigration,alt.politics.nationalism.white,talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: AP Lies by Ommission About Identity of Invaders Charged with
Rape, Murder of 12-Year-Old
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 12:35:52 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <v5f66o$1mps9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <v54h6j$39cuk$1@dont-email.me> <v54hrs$38mfs$18@dont-email.me>
<moKcnZP3dbqUm-r7nZ2dnZfqnPcAAAAA@giganews.com>
<v58c4f$6squ$8@dont-email.me>
<v5df1n$1caue$1@dont-email.me> <v5edju$1hv3p$3@dont-email.me>
<tgrl7j14lbg6f9csput4jca09qqujgd9d5@4ax.com>
<v5erpf$1jkrf$20@dont-email.me>
<O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
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Xref: news.eternal-september.org alt.politics.immigration:383549
alt.politics.nationalism.white:10913 talk.politics.misc:1295918
alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:3024985

> No. I am a patriotic American who wants the country and its people to
thrive. Getting rid of Trump permanently
> is an important step to getting there.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That constitutes a DEATH THREAT against a former President, Rudey:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871
18 U.S. Code § 871 - Threats against President and successors to the
Presidency
U.S. Code
Notes
prev | next
(a)Whoever knowingly and willfully deposits for conveyance in the mail
or for a delivery from any post office or by any letter carrier any
letter, paper, writing, print, missive, or document containing any
threat to take the life of, to kidnap, or to inflict bodily harm upon
the President of the United States, the President-elect, the Vice
President or other officer next in the order of succession to the office
of President of the United States, or the Vice President-elect, or
knowingly and willfully otherwise makes any such threat against the
President, President-elect, Vice President or other officer next in the
order of succession to the office of President, or Vice President-elect,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years,
or both.
(b)The terms “President-elect” and “Vice President-elect” as used in
this section shall mean such persons as are the apparent successful
candidates for the offices of President and Vice President,
respectively, as ascertained from the results of the general elections
held to determine the electors of President and Vice President in
accordance with title 3, United States Code, sections 1 and 2. The
phrase “other officer next in the order of succession to the office of
President” as used in this section shall mean the person next in the
order of succession to act as President in accordance with title 3,
United States Code, sections 19 and 20.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 740; June 1, 1955, ch. 115, § 1, 69
Stat. 80; Pub. L. 87–829, § 1, Oct. 15, 1962, 76 Stat. 956; Pub. L.
97–297, § 2, Oct. 12, 1982, 96 Stat. 1318; Pub. L. 103–322, title
XXXIII, § 330016(1)(H), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

9-65.200 - Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency; Threats Against Former Presidents; and Certain Other Secret
Service Protectees
The Counterterrorism Section of the National Security Division has
supervisory authority over 18 U.S.C. §§ 871 and 879 cases. As great
caution must be taken in matters relating to the security of the persons
protected by 18 U.S.C. § 871, United States Attorneys are encouraged to
consult with the Counterterrorism Section (CTS) of the National Security
Division when they have doubts on the prosecutive merit of a case. For
the same reason, dismissal of complaints under 18 U.S.C. § 871, when the
defendant is in custody under the Mental Incompetency Statutes (18
U.S.C. §§ 4244, 4246), requires approval from CTS. In other cases,
United States Attorneys must consult prior to dismissing a count
involving, or entering into any sentence commitment or other case
settlement involving a § 871 charge.

https://www.secretservice.gov/newsroom/releases/2024/01/phoenix-man-arrested-making-online-death-threats-against-president-and

PHOENIX –David Michael Hanson, 41, of Phoenix, was arrested on Wednesday
for making online threats against the President and Vice-President.
Hanson was charged by Federal criminal complaint on Tuesday with five
counts of Threats Against the President and Successors to the Presidency
and five counts of Interstate Communication of Threats.

The complaint alleges that in November and December of 2023, while
living in Arizona, Hanson used a social media platform to post threats
to murder the President and Vice President of the United States. On
November 19, 2023, Hanson posted online a series of threatening
statements including one that stated, “#joeAndKamala I’m asking you to
resign on Monday your alternative is death brutally murdered.” After the
U.S. Secret Service spoke to Hanson and warned him that it was a Federal
crime to post such threats, on December 23, 2023, Hanson posted another
series of similar threats aimed at the President and Vice-President.

Each count of Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency carries a maximum sentence of five years in prison, a fine of
up to $250,000, and up to three years of supervised release. Each count
of Interstate Communication of Threats carries a maximum sentence of
five years in prison, a fine of up to $250,000, and up to three years of
supervised release.

A complaint is simply a method by which a person is charged with
criminal activity and raises no inference of guilt. An individual is
presumed innocent until evidence is presented to a jury that establishes
guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

Governor Swill wrote:
> it'll turn out

Governor Swill /Rudy Canoza/Lou Bricano/J Carlson/Michael A
Terrell/Chris Ahlstrom/Intelligent Party/Alan Bond/Bill Flett/kami and a
few dozen other socks wrote:

Multiple death threats against Trump:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!border-1.nntp.ord.giganews.com!border-2.nntp.ord.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-out.netnews.com!netnews.com!s1-4.netnews.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!fx10.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <emo79jh20rlasuask9094vtlepuu5ui0av@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
<ONIkO.102541$dFU1.83026@fx11.ams4> <XnsB1AF52A9CDF3B629555@185.151.15.190>
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X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:38:43 -0400

Oh poor me I got shot at ...

Swill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <4ln79j914cpespbrssonesbciii33ess3m@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 3.3/32.846
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:37:51 -0400

Cheer up, maybe someone else will try.

Swill

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: J Carlson <j_carlson@gmx.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.politics.immigration,alt.politics.nationalism.white,talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: AP Lies by Ommission About Identity of Invaders Charged with
Rape, Murder of 12-Year-Old
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 12:35:52 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <v5f66o$1mps9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <v54h6j$39cuk$1@dont-email.me> <v54hrs$38mfs$18@dont-email.me>
<moKcnZP3dbqUm-r7nZ2dnZfqnPcAAAAA@giganews.com>
<v58c4f$6squ$8@dont-email.me>
<v5df1n$1caue$1@dont-email.me> <v5edju$1hv3p$3@dont-email.me>
<tgrl7j14lbg6f9csput4jca09qqujgd9d5@4ax.com>
<v5erpf$1jkrf$20@dont-email.me>
<O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
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logging-data="1795977";
mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";
posting-account="U2FsdGVkX195k8uMNmZfnyDG9tQmsu21WqljX3bfQxM="
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:PNoPW9d+9gKJj0fX+YCk+YFslQg=
Content-Language: en-US
In-Reply-To: <O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
Xref: news.eternal-september.org alt.politics.immigration:383549
alt.politics.nationalism.white:10913 talk.politics.misc:1295918
alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:3024985

> No. I am a patriotic American who wants the country and its people to
thrive. Getting rid of Trump permanently
> is an important step to getting there.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That constitutes a DEATH THREAT against a former President, Rudey:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871
18 U.S. Code § 871 - Threats against President and successors to the
Presidency
U.S. Code
Notes
prev | next
(a)Whoever knowingly and willfully deposits for conveyance in the mail
or for a delivery from any post office or by any letter carrier any
letter, paper, writing, print, missive, or document containing any
threat to take the life of, to kidnap, or to inflict bodily harm upon
the President of the United States, the President-elect, the Vice
President or other officer next in the order of succession to the office
of President of the United States, or the Vice President-elect, or
knowingly and willfully otherwise makes any such threat against the
President, President-elect, Vice President or other officer next in the
order of succession to the office of President, or Vice President-elect,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years,
or both.
(b)The terms “President-elect” and “Vice President-elect” as used in
this section shall mean such persons as are the apparent successful
candidates for the offices of President and Vice President,
respectively, as ascertained from the results of the general elections
held to determine the electors of President and Vice President in
accordance with title 3, United States Code, sections 1 and 2. The
phrase “other officer next in the order of succession to the office of
President” as used in this section shall mean the person next in the
order of succession to act as President in accordance with title 3,
United States Code, sections 19 and 20.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 740; June 1, 1955, ch. 115, § 1, 69
Stat. 80; Pub. L. 87–829, § 1, Oct. 15, 1962, 76 Stat. 956; Pub. L.
97–297, § 2, Oct. 12, 1982, 96 Stat. 1318; Pub. L. 103–322, title
XXXIII, § 330016(1)(H), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

9-65.200 - Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency; Threats Against Former Presidents; and Certain Other Secret
Service Protectees
The Counterterrorism Section of the National Security Division has
supervisory authority over 18 U.S.C. §§ 871 and 879 cases. As great
caution must be taken in matters relating to the security of the persons
protected by 18 U.S.C. § 871, United States Attorneys are encouraged to
consult with the Counterterrorism Section (CTS) of the National Security
Division when they have doubts on the prosecutive merit of a case. For
the same reason, dismissal of complaints under 18 U.S.C. § 871, when the
defendant is in custody under the Mental Incompetency Statutes (18
U.S.C. §§ 4244, 4246), requires approval from CTS. In other cases,
United States Attorneys must consult prior to dismissing a count
involving, or entering into any sentence commitment or other case
settlement involving a § 871 charge.

https://www.secretservice.gov/newsroom/releases/2024/01/phoenix-man-arrested-making-online-death-threats-against-president-and

PHOENIX –David Michael Hanson, 41, of Phoenix, was arrested on Wednesday
for making online threats against the President and Vice-President.
Hanson was charged by Federal criminal complaint on Tuesday with five
counts of Threats Against the President and Successors to the Presidency
and five counts of Interstate Communication of Threats.

The complaint alleges that in November and December of 2023, while
living in Arizona, Hanson used a social media platform to post threats
to murder the President and Vice President of the United States. On
November 19, 2023, Hanson posted online a series of threatening
statements including one that stated, “#joeAndKamala I’m asking you to
resign on Monday your alternative is death brutally murdered.” After the
U.S. Secret Service spoke to Hanson and warned him that it was a Federal
crime to post such threats, on December 23, 2023, Hanson posted another
series of similar threats aimed at the President and Vice-President.

Each count of Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency carries a maximum sentence of five years in prison, a fine of
up to $250,000, and up to three years of supervised release. Each count
of Interstate Communication of Threats carries a maximum sentence of
five years in prison, a fine of up to $250,000, and up to three years of
supervised release.

A complaint is simply a method by which a person is charged with
criminal activity and raises no inference of guilt. An individual is
presumed innocent until evidence is presented to a jury that establishes
guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

Governor Swill wrote:
> troll
> --
> #NEVER

Governor Swill /Rudy Canoza/Lou Bricano/J Carlson/Michael A
Terrell/Chris Ahlstrom/Intelligent Party/Alan Bond/Bill Flett/kami and a
few dozen other socks wrote:

Multiple death threats against Trump:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!border-1.nntp.ord.giganews.com!border-2.nntp.ord.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-out.netnews.com!netnews.com!s1-4.netnews.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!fx10.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <emo79jh20rlasuask9094vtlepuu5ui0av@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
<ONIkO.102541$dFU1.83026@fx11.ams4> <XnsB1AF52A9CDF3B629555@185.151.15.190>
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 3.3/32.846
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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X-Complaints-To: abuse@easynews.com
Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:38:43 -0400

Oh poor me I got shot at ...

Swill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <4ln79j914cpespbrssonesbciii33ess3m@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 3.3/32.846
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:37:51 -0400

Cheer up, maybe someone else will try.

Swill

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: J Carlson <j_carlson@gmx.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.politics.immigration,alt.politics.nationalism.white,talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: AP Lies by Ommission About Identity of Invaders Charged with
Rape, Murder of 12-Year-Old
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 12:35:52 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <v5f66o$1mps9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <v54h6j$39cuk$1@dont-email.me> <v54hrs$38mfs$18@dont-email.me>
<moKcnZP3dbqUm-r7nZ2dnZfqnPcAAAAA@giganews.com>
<v58c4f$6squ$8@dont-email.me>
<v5df1n$1caue$1@dont-email.me> <v5edju$1hv3p$3@dont-email.me>
<tgrl7j14lbg6f9csput4jca09qqujgd9d5@4ax.com>
<v5erpf$1jkrf$20@dont-email.me>
<O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
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Injection-Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 21:35:53 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me;
posting-host="f3de9d0c1e618b255237332494133eec";
logging-data="1795977";
mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";
posting-account="U2FsdGVkX195k8uMNmZfnyDG9tQmsu21WqljX3bfQxM="
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:PNoPW9d+9gKJj0fX+YCk+YFslQg=
Content-Language: en-US
In-Reply-To: <O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
Xref: news.eternal-september.org alt.politics.immigration:383549
alt.politics.nationalism.white:10913 talk.politics.misc:1295918
alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:3024985

> No. I am a patriotic American who wants the country and its people to
thrive. Getting rid of Trump permanently
> is an important step to getting there.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That constitutes a DEATH THREAT against a former President, Rudey:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871
18 U.S. Code § 871 - Threats against President and successors to the
Presidency
U.S. Code
Notes
prev | next
(a)Whoever knowingly and willfully deposits for conveyance in the mail
or for a delivery from any post office or by any letter carrier any
letter, paper, writing, print, missive, or document containing any
threat to take the life of, to kidnap, or to inflict bodily harm upon
the President of the United States, the President-elect, the Vice
President or other officer next in the order of succession to the office
of President of the United States, or the Vice President-elect, or
knowingly and willfully otherwise makes any such threat against the
President, President-elect, Vice President or other officer next in the
order of succession to the office of President, or Vice President-elect,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years,
or both.
(b)The terms “President-elect” and “Vice President-elect” as used in
this section shall mean such persons as are the apparent successful
candidates for the offices of President and Vice President,
respectively, as ascertained from the results of the general elections
held to determine the electors of President and Vice President in
accordance with title 3, United States Code, sections 1 and 2. The
phrase “other officer next in the order of succession to the office of
President” as used in this section shall mean the person next in the
order of succession to act as President in accordance with title 3,
United States Code, sections 19 and 20.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 740; June 1, 1955, ch. 115, § 1, 69
Stat. 80; Pub. L. 87–829, § 1, Oct. 15, 1962, 76 Stat. 956; Pub. L.
97–297, § 2, Oct. 12, 1982, 96 Stat. 1318; Pub. L. 103–322, title
XXXIII, § 330016(1)(H), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

9-65.200 - Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency; Threats Against Former Presidents; and Certain Other Secret
Service Protectees
The Counterterrorism Section of the National Security Division has
supervisory authority over 18 U.S.C. §§ 871 and 879 cases. As great
caution must be taken in matters relating to the security of the persons
protected by 18 U.S.C. § 871, United States Attorneys are encouraged to
consult with the Counterterrorism Section (CTS) of the National Security
Division when they have doubts on the prosecutive merit of a case. For
the same reason, dismissal of complaints under 18 U.S.C. § 871, when the
defendant is in custody under the Mental Incompetency Statutes (18
U.S.C. §§ 4244, 4246), requires approval from CTS. In other cases,
United States Attorneys must consult prior to dismissing a count
involving, or entering into any sentence commitment or other case
settlement involving a § 871 charge.

https://www.secretservice.gov/newsroom/releases/2024/01/phoenix-man-arrested-making-online-death-threats-against-president-and

PHOENIX –David Michael Hanson, 41, of Phoenix, was arrested on Wednesday
for making online threats against the President and Vice-President.
Hanson was charged by Federal criminal complaint on Tuesday with five
counts of Threats Against the President and Successors to the Presidency
and five counts of Interstate Communication of Threats.

The complaint alleges that in November and December of 2023, while
living in Arizona, Hanson used a social media platform to post threats
to murder the President and Vice President of the United States. On
November 19, 2023, Hanson posted online a series of threatening
statements including one that stated, “#joeAndKamala I’m asking you to
resign on Monday your alternative is death brutally murdered.” After the
U.S. Secret Service spoke to Hanson and warned him that it was a Federal
crime to post such threats, on December 23, 2023, Hanson posted another
series of similar threats aimed at the President and Vice-President.

Each count of Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency carries a maximum sentence of five years in prison, a fine of
up to $250,000, and up to three years of supervised release. Each count
of Interstate Communication of Threats carries a maximum sentence of
five years in prison, a fine of up to $250,000, and up to three years of
supervised release.

A complaint is simply a method by which a person is charged with
criminal activity and raises no inference of guilt. An individual is
presumed innocent until evidence is presented to a jury that establishes
guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

On Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:49:12 -0400, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:

>> Further as trustees of the SSA, the fact they have bleed the assets into
>> ultralow yield government bonds should be grounds from criminal charges.>
>> I mean if I took my parent's trust fund and invested it in special low
>> yield stock in my company... I would be charged with embezzlement... but
>> not Congress critters.
>
>But if it were invested in the private sector, you'd be complaining that
>it is "choosing winners & losers".

*applause*

Scammin' the scammers
<https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XAtI4TScydw>

--
Drumpf making fun of a disabled reporter
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNXgjnBpxGI>

Meanwhile, his asshole fans behind him are smiling.

-hh wrote:

>Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>them

I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
in there, their party will force them to hew the line.

On 2024-09-06, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> -hh wrote:
>
>>Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>>them
>
> I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
> in there, their party will force them to hew the line.
>
Indeed.
It's become a uniparty with 2 factions. Far left and far right. Neither of which benefit the
people.

--
pothead
Tommy Chong For President 2024.
Crazy Joe Biden Is A Demented Imbecile.
Impeach Joe Biden 2022.

Governor Swill wrote:
> *applause*
>
> Scammin'

Governor Swill /Rudy Canoza/Lou Bricano/J Carlson/Michael A
Terrell/Chris Ahlstrom/Intelligent Party/Alan Bond/Bill Flett/kami and a
few dozen other socks wrote:

Multiple death threats against Trump:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!border-1.nntp.ord.giganews.com!border-2.nntp.ord.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-out.netnews.com!netnews.com!s1-4.netnews.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!fx10.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <emo79jh20rlasuask9094vtlepuu5ui0av@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
<ONIkO.102541$dFU1.83026@fx11.ams4> <XnsB1AF52A9CDF3B629555@185.151.15.190>
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 3.3/32.846
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 55
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:38:43 -0400

Oh poor me I got shot at ...

Swill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <4ln79j914cpespbrssonesbciii33ess3m@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:37:51 -0400

Cheer up, maybe someone else will try.

Swill

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: J Carlson <j_carlson@gmx.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.politics.immigration,alt.politics.nationalism.white,talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: AP Lies by Ommission About Identity of Invaders Charged with
Rape, Murder of 12-Year-Old
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 12:35:52 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <v5f66o$1mps9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <v54h6j$39cuk$1@dont-email.me> <v54hrs$38mfs$18@dont-email.me>
<moKcnZP3dbqUm-r7nZ2dnZfqnPcAAAAA@giganews.com>
<v58c4f$6squ$8@dont-email.me>
<v5df1n$1caue$1@dont-email.me> <v5edju$1hv3p$3@dont-email.me>
<tgrl7j14lbg6f9csput4jca09qqujgd9d5@4ax.com>
<v5erpf$1jkrf$20@dont-email.me>
<O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 21:35:53 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me;
posting-host="f3de9d0c1e618b255237332494133eec";
logging-data="1795977";
mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";
posting-account="U2FsdGVkX195k8uMNmZfnyDG9tQmsu21WqljX3bfQxM="
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:PNoPW9d+9gKJj0fX+YCk+YFslQg=
Content-Language: en-US
In-Reply-To: <O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
Xref: news.eternal-september.org alt.politics.immigration:383549
alt.politics.nationalism.white:10913 talk.politics.misc:1295918
alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:3024985

> No. I am a patriotic American who wants the country and its people to
thrive. Getting rid of Trump permanently
> is an important step to getting there.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That constitutes a DEATH THREAT against a former President, Rudey:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871
18 U.S. Code § 871 - Threats against President and successors to the
Presidency
U.S. Code
Notes
prev | next
(a)Whoever knowingly and willfully deposits for conveyance in the mail
or for a delivery from any post office or by any letter carrier any
letter, paper, writing, print, missive, or document containing any
threat to take the life of, to kidnap, or to inflict bodily harm upon
the President of the United States, the President-elect, the Vice
President or other officer next in the order of succession to the office
of President of the United States, or the Vice President-elect, or
knowingly and willfully otherwise makes any such threat against the
President, President-elect, Vice President or other officer next in the
order of succession to the office of President, or Vice President-elect,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years,
or both.
(b)The terms “President-elect” and “Vice President-elect” as used in
this section shall mean such persons as are the apparent successful
candidates for the offices of President and Vice President,
respectively, as ascertained from the results of the general elections
held to determine the electors of President and Vice President in
accordance with title 3, United States Code, sections 1 and 2. The
phrase “other officer next in the order of succession to the office of
President” as used in this section shall mean the person next in the
order of succession to act as President in accordance with title 3,
United States Code, sections 19 and 20.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 740; June 1, 1955, ch. 115, § 1, 69
Stat. 80; Pub. L. 87–829, § 1, Oct. 15, 1962, 76 Stat. 956; Pub. L.
97–297, § 2, Oct. 12, 1982, 96 Stat. 1318; Pub. L. 103–322, title
XXXIII, § 330016(1)(H), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

9-65.200 - Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency; Threats Against Former Presidents; and Certain Other Secret
Service Protectees
The Counterterrorism Section of the National Security Division has
supervisory authority over 18 U.S.C. §§ 871 and 879 cases. As great
caution must be taken in matters relating to the security of the persons
protected by 18 U.S.C. § 871, United States Attorneys are encouraged to
consult with the Counterterrorism Section (CTS) of the National Security
Division when they have doubts on the prosecutive merit of a case. For
the same reason, dismissal of complaints under 18 U.S.C. § 871, when the
defendant is in custody under the Mental Incompetency Statutes (18
U.S.C. §§ 4244, 4246), requires approval from CTS. In other cases,
United States Attorneys must consult prior to dismissing a count
involving, or entering into any sentence commitment or other case
settlement involving a § 871 charge.

https://www.secretservice.gov/newsroom/releases/2024/01/phoenix-man-arrested-making-online-death-threats-against-president-and

PHOENIX –David Michael Hanson, 41, of Phoenix, was arrested on Wednesday
for making online threats against the President and Vice-President.
Hanson was charged by Federal criminal complaint on Tuesday with five
counts of Threats Against the President and Successors to the Presidency
and five counts of Interstate Communication of Threats.

The complaint alleges that in November and December of 2023, while
living in Arizona, Hanson used a social media platform to post threats
to murder the President and Vice President of the United States. On
November 19, 2023, Hanson posted online a series of threatening
statements including one that stated, “#joeAndKamala I’m asking you to
resign on Monday your alternative is death brutally murdered.” After the
U.S. Secret Service spoke to Hanson and warned him that it was a Federal
crime to post such threats, on December 23, 2023, Hanson posted another
series of similar threats aimed at the President and Vice-President.

Each count of Threats Against the President and Successors to the
Presidency carries a maximum sentence of five years in prison, a fine of
up to $250,000, and up to three years of supervised release. Each count
of Interstate Communication of Threats carries a maximum sentence of
five years in prison, a fine of up to $250,000, and up to three years of
supervised release.

A complaint is simply a method by which a person is charged with
criminal activity and raises no inference of guilt. An individual is
presumed innocent until evidence is presented to a jury that establishes
guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

On Fri, 6 Sep 2024 13:28:13 -0000 (UTC), pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:

>On 2024-09-06, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>> -hh wrote:
>>
>>>Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>>>them
>>
>> I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
>> in there, their party will force them to hew the line.
>>
>Indeed.
>It's become a uniparty with 2 factions. Far left and far right. Neither of which benefit the
>people.

Uniparty is yet another bit of MAGA bullshit. There are two parties and they
work together to solve the nation's issues. Compromise is central to a
functioning government. Without compromise, there wouldn't be a United States
because the Constitution would not have been accepted by all 13 colonies.
Undoubtedly Imperial Europe would have gobbled those colonies back up, bit by
bit. The Louisiana Purchase would never have been made, Spain would own a
quarter of the US, France another third while they and Great Britain would have
ended up sharing what was left.

My way or the highway can only result in the collapse of our nation. There is,
always has been and always will be, more than one point of view and that means
compromise MUST happen. It isn't an option.

--
Drumpf making fun of a disabled reporter
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNXgjnBpxGI>

Meanwhile, his asshole fans behind him are smiling.

Governor Swill wrote:
> It isn't an option.

Yet another death threat on a political candidate from Rudey - and this
time his family too!

From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: School Shootings Are Just "A Fact Of Life"?
Message-ID: <bg2mdjls1ircv7seclgrkgk2276doac82d@4ax.com>
References: <MZWcnfjw08qQ9kf7nZ2dnZfqnPWdnZ2d@giganews.com>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2024 09:58:32 -0400

> On Fri, 06 Sep 2024 02:38:05 +0000, "Lee" <cleetis@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> JD Vance says he laments that school
>> shootings are a ‘fact of life’
>> Sept 5
>>
>> security to prevent more carnage
>> like the shooting this week that
>> left four dead in Georgia.
>
> Let's hope his kids are the next ones shot to death in their classroom.

Added to:

Multiple death threats against Trump:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <emo79jh20rlasuask9094vtlepuu5ui0av@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
<ONIkO.102541$dFU1.83026@fx11.ams4> <XnsB1AF52A9CDF3B629555@185.151.15.190>
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:38:43 -0400

Oh poor me I got shot at ...

Swill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Multiple death threats against Trump:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!border-1.nntp.ord.giganews.com!border-2.nntp.ord.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-out.netnews.com!netnews.com!s1-4.netnews.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!fx10.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <emo79jh20rlasuask9094vtlepuu5ui0av@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
<ONIkO.102541$dFU1.83026@fx11.ams4> <XnsB1AF52A9CDF3B629555@185.151.15.190>
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:38:43 -0400

Oh poor me I got shot at ...

Swill
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Path:
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From: Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.misc,alt.politics,alt.politics.usa,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.elections
Subject: Re: Triumphant Trump Photo After Assassination Attempt
Message-ID: <4ln79j914cpespbrssonesbciii33ess3m@4ax.com>
References: <1oKdnTc9CYmJlg77nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@earthlink.com>
<XnsB1AED5FEA65AA629555@185.151.15.160>
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Organization: Easynews - www.easynews.com
X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2024 10:37:51 -0400

Cheer up, maybe someone else will try.

Swill

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: J Carlson <j_carlson@gmx.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.politics.immigration,alt.politics.nationalism.white,talk.politics.misc,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: AP Lies by Ommission About Identity of Invaders Charged with
Rape, Murder of 12-Year-Old
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2024 12:35:52 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <v5f66o$1mps9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <v54h6j$39cuk$1@dont-email.me> <v54hrs$38mfs$18@dont-email.me>
<moKcnZP3dbqUm-r7nZ2dnZfqnPcAAAAA@giganews.com>
<v58c4f$6squ$8@dont-email.me>
<v5df1n$1caue$1@dont-email.me> <v5edju$1hv3p$3@dont-email.me>
<tgrl7j14lbg6f9csput4jca09qqujgd9d5@4ax.com>
<v5erpf$1jkrf$20@dont-email.me>
<O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
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posting-host="f3de9d0c1e618b255237332494133eec";
logging-data="1795977";
mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";
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User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
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Content-Language: en-US
In-Reply-To: <O9acnRiefIZol-b7nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
Xref: news.eternal-september.org alt.politics.immigration:383549
alt.politics.nationalism.white:10913 talk.politics.misc:1295918
alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:3024985

> No. I am a patriotic American who wants the country and its people to
thrive. Getting rid of Trump permanently
> is an important step to getting there.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That constitutes a DEATH THREAT against a former President, Rudey:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871
18 U.S. Code § 871 - Threats against President and successors to the
Presidency
U.S. Code
Notes
prev | next
(a)Whoever knowingly and willfully deposits for conveyance in the mail
or for a delivery from any post office or by any letter carrier any
letter, paper, writing, print, missive, or document containing any
threat to take the life of, to kidnap, or to inflict bodily harm upon
the President of the United States, the President-elect, the Vice
President or other officer next in the order of succession to the office
of President of the United States, or the Vice President-elect, or
knowingly and willfully otherwise makes any such threat against the
President, President-elect, Vice President or other officer next in the
order of succession to the office of President, or Vice President-elect,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years,
or both.
(b)The terms “President-elect” and “Vice President-elect” as used in
this section shall mean such persons as are the apparent successful
candidates for the offices of President and Vice President,
respectively, as ascertained from the results of the general elections
held to determine the electors of President and Vice President in
accordance with title 3, United States Code, sections 1 and 2. The
phrase “other officer next in the order of succession to the office of
President” as used in this section shall mean the person next in the
order of succession to act as President in accordance with title 3,
United States Code, sections 19 and 20.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 740; June 1, 1955, ch. 115, § 1, 69
Stat. 80; Pub. L. 87–829, § 1, Oct. 15, 1962, 76 Stat. 956; Pub. L.
97–297, § 2, Oct. 12, 1982, 96 Stat. 1318; Pub. L. 103–322, title
XXXIII, § 330016(1)(H), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

On 06/09/2024 20:16, Lil dwarf Rudey wrote:
[....]
>
> Fellow citizens, won't you join in ending Rudey's terrorism here?

No. Sorry. I live in the UK.

David Brooks wrote:
> On 06/09/2024 20:16, Lil dwarf Rudey wrote:
> [....]
>>
>> Fellow citizens, won't you join in ending Rudey's terrorism here?
>
> No. Sorry. I live in the UK.

No worries then, carry on.

On Fri, 6 Sep 2024 20:24:05 +0100, David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

>On 06/09/2024 20:16, Lil dwarf Rudey wrote:
>[....]
>>
>> Fellow citizens, won't you join in ending Rudey's terrorism here?
>
>No. Sorry. I live in the UK.

Ugh, is that twat still spamming threats of reporting me to the FBI?

LOL!

Things you can say about your clothes that you can't say about your partner.
Have to steam that.

--
Drumpf making fun of a disabled reporter
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNXgjnBpxGI>

Meanwhile, his asshole fans behind him are smiling.

In article <2himdjhc7qf0opuj9rrqjji30bv6pnq9pv@4ax.com>,
governor.swill@gmail.com says...
>
> On Fri, 6 Sep 2024 13:28:13 -0000 (UTC), pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:
>
> >On 2024-09-06, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> >> -hh wrote:
> >>
> >>>Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
> >>>them
> >>
> >> I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
> >> in there, their party will force them to hew the line.
> >>
> >Indeed.
> >It's become a uniparty with 2 factions. Far left and far right. Neither of which benefit the
> >people.
>
> Uniparty is yet another bit of MAGA bullshit. There are two parties and they
> work together to solve the nation's issues.

When have they ever "worked together"?

On Sep 6, 2024 at 4:59:37 PM MST, "Skeeter" wrote
<66db975b$10$1780$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>:

> In article <2himdjhc7qf0opuj9rrqjji30bv6pnq9pv@4ax.com>,
> governor.swill@gmail.com says...
>>
>> On Fri, 6 Sep 2024 13:28:13 -0000 (UTC), pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2024-09-06, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>>>> -hh wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>>>>> them
>>>>
>>>> I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
>>>> in there, their party will force them to hew the line.
>>>>
>>> Indeed.
>>> It's become a uniparty with 2 factions. Far left and far right. Neither of
>>> which benefit the
>>> people.
>>
>> Uniparty is yet another bit of MAGA bullshit. There are two parties and they
>> work together to solve the nation's issues.
>
> When have they ever "worked together"?

They do all the time to help those who fund them.

--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

On 07/09/2024 00:59, Skeeter wrote:
> In article <2himdjhc7qf0opuj9rrqjji30bv6pnq9pv@4ax.com>,
> governor.swill@gmail.com says...
>>
>> On Fri, 6 Sep 2024 13:28:13 -0000 (UTC), pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2024-09-06, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>>>> -hh wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>>>>> them
>>>>
>>>> I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
>>>> in there, their party will force them to hew the line.
>>>>
>>> Indeed.
>>> It's become a uniparty with 2 factions. Far left and far right. Neither of which benefit the
>>> people.
>>
>> Uniparty is yet another bit of MAGA bullshit. There are two parties and they
>> work together to solve the nation's issues.
>
> When have they ever "worked together"?

The never have .... nor will!

IMO, of course! ;-)

On Sat, 7 Sep 2024 09:01:50 +0100, David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

>On 07/09/2024 00:59, Skeeter wrote:
>> In article <2himdjhc7qf0opuj9rrqjji30bv6pnq9pv@4ax.com>,
>> governor.swill@gmail.com says...
>>>
>>> On Fri, 6 Sep 2024 13:28:13 -0000 (UTC), pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-09-06, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> -hh wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>>>>>> them
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm afraid that it's too late, for that. Even if a decent person gets
>>>>> in there, their party will force them to hew the line.
>>>>>
>>>> Indeed.
>>>> It's become a uniparty with 2 factions. Far left and far right. Neither of which benefit the
>>>> people.
>>>
>>> Uniparty is yet another bit of MAGA bullshit. There are two parties and they
>>> work together to solve the nation's issues.
>>
>> When have they ever "worked together"?
>
>The never have .... nor will!
>
>IMO, of course! ;-)

The parties have worked together and quite well for most of US history. It's
*supposed* to be a struggle. That way the best ideas are more likely to
survive.

Even when the Dems had veto and filibuster proof majorities, Republican input
was still welcomed. In the eighties and even the Clinton years when the Reps
ran Congress, the parties worked together. During Bush I there was a bit of
gridlock, but since Bush II left office, the Republicans have taken a my way or
the highway approach that is damaging to the Republic.

--
"In 2008, the eurozone and the US had equivalent gross domestic products (GDP) at current
prices of $14.2 trillion and $14.8 trillion respectively (€13.1 trillion and €13.6 trillion).
Fifteen years on, the eurozone's GDP is just over $15 trillion, while US GDP has soared to $26.9 trillion."
<https://www.lemonde.fr/en/opinion/article/2023/09/04/the-gdp-gap-between-europe-and-the-united-states-is-now-80_6123491_23.html>

Between 2008 and now, we've had 4 years of Republicans and 12 years of Democrats running the country.

You do the math.

#nevertrump

"-hh" <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in message
news:vbcuf8$ahp0$1@dont-email.me...
> On 9/4/24 3:05 PM, Scout wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Jayle Byrd" <jbyrd@privacy.net> wrote in message
>> news:vba9tc$3vq6d$5@news.mixmin.net...
>>> On 9/4/2024 9:48 AM, Scout wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:fkqedj9og6n3k9tv8gj19daroi26mvd4rp@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Tue, 3 Sep 2024 09:30:08 -0500, "Scout" wrote:
>>>>>> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 8/30/24 3:41 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> <snip>
>>>>>>>>>> ...and just wait until P2025 abolishes police, fire, & weather
>>>>>>>>>> services:
>>>>>>>>>> better start to calculate how much more its going to cost an
>>>>>>>>>> individual citizen to replace just these services with privately
>>>>>>>>>> run (&
>>>>>>>>>> for-profit) services.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I guarantee you it will cost more than the tax savings. Then
>>>>>>>>> there'll
>>>>>>>>> be the lawsuits filed by the homeowners whose houses caught
>>>>>>>>> fire because a neighbor didn't have a fire service contract.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Agreed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is merely YA example of where it becomes painfully clear just
>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>>> bad many people are at actually developing an expenses budget, and
>>>>>>>> then
>>>>>>>> go on to make bad decisions that are against their own self
>>>>>>>> interests.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> FWIW, another common example of this is how they claim that EU
>>>>>>>> taxes are
>>>>>>>> frightfully bad (eg, 44%), not realizing that it includes
>>>>>>>> healthcare and
>>>>>>>> higher education, so the correct comparison starts their own 22%
>>>>>>>> Fed
>>>>>>>> rate, but then adds +32% ($25K/Median Income) for healthcare, plus
>>>>>>>> let's
>>>>>>>> say +1% for college/etc, for (22% + 32% + 1%) = 55% >> more than
>>>>>>>> EU.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Top five national income tax rates.
>>>>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/shorts/H1LJylHMPz0>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So you're trying to prove your point by ignoring many taxes...
>>>>>
>>>>> My point is that in exchange for their higher taxes, Europeans get a
>>>>> lot more
>>>>> than we do. Free university education. No/low co-pay healthcare
>>>>> including
>>>>> prescriptions. Vast public transportation networks that make it
>>>>> unnecessary to
>>>>> own a car for most people and one of the best quality road networks on
>>>>> the
>>>>> planet. European highways are built to last twice as long as ours.
>>>>>
>>>>> Caveat: Their defense budgets have historically been lower than ours
>>>>> owing to
>>>>> our investment in our mutual security. Think about post WW II. Who
>>>>> in their
>>>>> right mind would want to see Europe rearm itself? Nobody. For that
>>>>> reason, we
>>>>> dominated European security to avoid the risks of them rearming.
>>>>>
>>>>> That danger is now past with the EU and Schweringen so they can now
>>>>> arm
>>>>> themselves in earnest. And they are.
>>>>>
>>>>>> But let's go with income tax.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In California combined state and federal income tax takes over 50% of
>>>>>> your
>>>>>> income.
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, that's right wing propaganda because California, like federal,
>>>>> has a
>>>>> progressive tax rate and their top marginal rate is currently 14.4%.
>>>>> The
>>>>> federal is 37%, but those are "top marginal" rates. For those who
>>>>> don't know
>>>>> haw marginal rates work:
>>>>
>>>> You're just looking at income tax.. do you think that the ONLY tax that
>>>> exists?
>>>>
>>>> Heck, pretty soon Kamala would be evicting people from their homes
>>>> because they can't pay the 25% in the unrealized income from any
>>>> increase in the value of their home.
>>>>
>>>> Further, I don't see Europe ignoring their homeless while being able to
>>>> pay to fly illegal immigrants here and arranging their illegal entry
>>>> into the country, while then providing them housing, food, jobs,
>>>> transportation and legal representation while the government pretends
>>>> that deportation would ever occur for them.
>>>>
>>>> I wonder how much the money spend on opening the border and all the
>>>> care given to those who ignored are laws would have done to help our
>>>> own homeless and poor????
>>>>
>>>> I heard somewhere this has cost $451 Billion/year so far, and let's say
>>>> half of that/
>>>>
>>>> https://www.nationalreview.com/news/border-crisis-costs-american-
>>>> taxpayers-451-billion-annually-house-gop-report-claims/
>>>>
>>>> We currently have (according to HUD, 653,104 homeless Americans) that's
>>>> $345,274 per person.
>>>>
>>>> In ONE year we could virtually eliminate our homeless problem and
>>>> certainly within 2.
>>>>
>>>> Instead, we allow a lot of homeless illegal immigrants who then compete
>>>> with poor americans for housing, jobs, food, etc.
>>>>
>>>> So tell me, give our TOTAL level of taxation is higher than in Europe..
>>>> why don't we have such things here????
>>>>
>>>> I mean Democrats are seriously talking about taxing money that people
>>>> don't even have.
>>>>
>>>> How long until grandma is evicted from her home because she can't pay
>>>> the 25% tax on the unrealized income made from the increase in property
>>>> values?
>>>
>>> "Fight to stop 96-year-old Pacific Grove woman's eviction continues"
>>>
>>> https://www.ksbw.com/article/california-96-year-old-pacific-grove-
>>> womans-eviction/62046753
>>>
>>>> Who will buy these homes? Corporations will who will then make you pay
>>>> to live in them because you can't afford to buy a home.
>>>
>>> That is exactly what they are doing and why homes have become
>>> unaffordable.
>>>
>>>> How about the 25% you will have to pay on the income your 401K, and
>>>> what will you do for retirement with the government sucking all that
>>>> income from your retirement account?
>>>
>>> Biden stole 30% from 401k savings in 2023.
>>>
>>>> And in the end will it really change how the rich do things? No, it
>>>> wont'.
>>>
>>> Putting Nancy Pelosi in jail for inside trading and graft would would be
>>> a good start.
>>
>> That's one I could NEVER understand.. how did Congress EVER get to the
>> point that the laws they create for everyone else does NOT apply to them.
>
>
> Because too many politicians today are selfish money grubbing assholes,
> with zero interest in Public Service. Its also why there's sections of
> the tax code which have so many qualification requirements that they
> literally only apply to one (nicely donating) taxpayer.
>
>
>
>> Frankly I would love to throw those those into jail.
>>
>> Our leadership was NEVER suppose to be 'above the law' yet that's exactly
>> what we have. Further, due to insider trading, their decisions can now
>> become decided not what is best for the nation, but rather which stocks
>> will move the most and how much can they profit personally choosing B
>> over A.
>
> Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for them
> .. and for SCOTUS too.
>
>
>> You will also note that THEIR retirement funds don't go into SSA, but
>> rather their own PRIVATE fund. Why is that? If SSA is good enough for the
>> rest of us it should be good enough for them.
>
> Incorrect; Feds do pay into SSA.

"Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:6mlkdjpqopg9f04cdeanrau61ccetfbeg7@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:49:12 -0400, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com>
> wrote:
>
>>> Further as trustees of the SSA, the fact they have bleed the assets into
>>> ultralow yield government bonds should be grounds from criminal
>>> charges.>
>>> I mean if I took my parent's trust fund and invested it in special low
>>> yield stock in my company... I would be charged with embezzlement... but
>>> not Congress critters.
>>
>>But if it were invested in the private sector, you'd be complaining that
>>it is "choosing winners & losers".
>
> *applause*

Perhaps, but going with a straight fortune 500 might be a good start.

Better than the return the substandard government securities have, which is
just us paying the interest, as well as the principle they have 'borrowed'.
We're barely making inflation rates with 3% interest. That's a pretty shitty
retirement account that gains no value.....

On 9/9/24 11:48 AM, Scout wrote:
>
>
> "-hh" <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in message
> news:vbcuf8$ahp0$1@dont-email.me...
>> On 9/4/24 3:05 PM, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Jayle Byrd" <jbyrd@privacy.net> wrote in message
>>> news:vba9tc$3vq6d$5@news.mixmin.net...
>>>> On 9/4/2024 9:48 AM, Scout wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:fkqedj9og6n3k9tv8gj19daroi26mvd4rp@4ax.com...
>>>>>> On Tue, 3 Sep 2024 09:30:08 -0500, "Scout" wrote:
>>>>>>> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote
>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 8/30/24 3:41 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>  -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> <snip>
>>>>>>>>>>> ...and just wait until P2025 abolishes police, fire, & weather
>>>>>>>>>>> services:
>>>>>>>>>>>   better start to calculate how much more its going to cost an
>>>>>>>>>>> individual citizen to replace just these services with
>>>>>>>>>>> privately run (&
>>>>>>>>>>> for-profit) services.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I guarantee you it will cost more than the tax savings.  Then
>>>>>>>>>> there'll
>>>>>>>>>> be the lawsuits filed by the homeowners whose houses caught
>>>>>>>>>>  fire because a neighbor didn't have a fire service contract.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Agreed.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This is merely YA example of where it becomes painfully clear
>>>>>>>>> just how
>>>>>>>>> bad many people are at actually developing an expenses budget,
>>>>>>>>> and then
>>>>>>>>> go on to make bad decisions that are against their own self
>>>>>>>>> interests.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> FWIW, another common example of this is how they claim that EU
>>>>>>>>> taxes are
>>>>>>>>> frightfully bad (eg, 44%), not realizing that it includes
>>>>>>>>> healthcare and
>>>>>>>>> higher education, so the correct comparison starts their own
>>>>>>>>> 22% Fed
>>>>>>>>> rate, but then adds +32% ($25K/Median Income) for healthcare,
>>>>>>>>> plus let's
>>>>>>>>> say +1% for college/etc, for (22% + 32% + 1%) = 55% >> more
>>>>>>>>> than EU.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Top five national income tax rates.
>>>>>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/shorts/H1LJylHMPz0>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So you're trying to prove your point by ignoring many taxes...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My point is that in exchange for their higher taxes, Europeans get
>>>>>> a lot more
>>>>>> than we do.  Free university education.  No/low co-pay healthcare
>>>>>> including
>>>>>> prescriptions.  Vast public transportation networks that make it
>>>>>> unnecessary to
>>>>>> own a car for most people and one of the best quality road
>>>>>> networks on the
>>>>>> planet.  European highways are built to last twice as long as ours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Caveat:  Their defense budgets have historically been lower than
>>>>>> ours owing to
>>>>>> our investment in our mutual security.  Think about post WW II.
>>>>>> Who in their
>>>>>> right mind would want to see Europe rearm itself?  Nobody.  For
>>>>>> that reason, we
>>>>>> dominated European security to avoid the risks of them rearming.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That danger is now past with the EU and Schweringen so they can
>>>>>> now arm
>>>>>> themselves in earnest.  And they are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But let's go with income tax.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In California combined state and federal income tax takes over
>>>>>>> 50% of your
>>>>>>> income.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well, that's right wing propaganda because California, like
>>>>>> federal, has a
>>>>>> progressive tax rate and their top marginal rate is currently
>>>>>> 14.4%. The
>>>>>> federal is 37%, but those are "top marginal" rates.  For those who
>>>>>> don't know
>>>>>> haw marginal rates work:
>>>>>
>>>>> You're just looking at income tax.. do you think that the ONLY tax
>>>>> that exists?
>>>>>
>>>>> Heck, pretty soon Kamala would be evicting people from their homes
>>>>> because they can't pay the 25% in the unrealized income from any
>>>>> increase in the value of their home.
>>>>>
>>>>> Further, I don't see Europe ignoring their homeless while being
>>>>> able to pay to fly illegal immigrants here and arranging their
>>>>> illegal entry into the country, while then providing them housing,
>>>>> food, jobs, transportation and legal representation while the
>>>>> government pretends that deportation would ever occur for them.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wonder how much the money spend on opening the border and all the
>>>>> care given to those who ignored are laws would have done to help
>>>>> our own homeless and poor????
>>>>>
>>>>> I heard somewhere this has cost $451 Billion/year so far, and let's
>>>>> say half of that/
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.nationalreview.com/news/border-crisis-costs-american-
>>>>> taxpayers-451-billion-annually-house-gop-report-claims/
>>>>>
>>>>> We currently have (according to HUD, 653,104 homeless Americans)
>>>>> that's $345,274 per person.
>>>>>
>>>>> In ONE year we could virtually eliminate our homeless problem and
>>>>> certainly within 2.
>>>>>
>>>>> Instead, we allow a lot of homeless illegal immigrants who then
>>>>> compete with poor americans for housing, jobs, food, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> So tell me, give our TOTAL level of taxation is higher than in
>>>>> Europe.. why don't we have such things here????
>>>>>
>>>>> I mean Democrats are seriously talking about taxing money that
>>>>> people don't even have.
>>>>>
>>>>> How long until grandma is evicted from her home because she can't
>>>>> pay the 25% tax on the unrealized income made from the increase in
>>>>> property values?
>>>>
>>>> "Fight to stop 96-year-old Pacific Grove woman's eviction continues"
>>>>
>>>> https://www.ksbw.com/article/california-96-year-old-pacific-grove-
>>>> womans-eviction/62046753
>>>>
>>>>> Who will buy these homes? Corporations will who will then make you
>>>>> pay to live in them because you can't afford to buy a home.
>>>>
>>>> That is exactly what they are doing and why homes have become
>>>> unaffordable.
>>>>
>>>>> How about the 25% you will have to pay on the income your 401K, and
>>>>> what will you do for retirement with the government sucking all
>>>>> that income from your retirement account?
>>>>
>>>> Biden stole 30% from 401k savings in 2023.
>>>>
>>>>> And in the end will it really change how the rich do things? No, it
>>>>> wont'.
>>>>
>>>> Putting Nancy Pelosi in jail for inside trading and graft would
>>>> would be a good start.
>>>
>>> That's one I could NEVER understand.. how did Congress EVER get to
>>> the point that the laws they create for everyone else does NOT apply
>>> to them.
>>
>>
>> Because too many politicians today are selfish money grubbing
>> assholes, with zero interest in Public Service.  Its also why there's
>> sections of the tax code which have so many qualification requirements
>> that they literally only apply to one (nicely donating) taxpayer.
>>
>>
>>
>>> Frankly I would love to throw those those into jail.
>>>
>>> Our leadership was NEVER suppose to be 'above the law' yet that's
>>> exactly what we have. Further, due to insider trading, their
>>> decisions can now become decided not what is best for the nation, but
>>> rather which stocks will move the most and how much can they profit
>>> personally choosing B over A.
>>
>> Then stop voting those jerks into office & support ethics reforms for
>> them .. and for SCOTUS too.
>>
>>
>>> You will also note that THEIR retirement funds don't go into SSA, but
>>> rather their own PRIVATE fund. Why is that? If SSA is good enough for
>>> the rest of us it should be good enough for them.
>>
>> Incorrect; Feds do pay into SSA.
>
> I wasn't talking feds, I'm talking Congress which runs it's own little
> independent fund for themselves.

On 9/9/24 11:51 AM, Scout wrote:
>
>
> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:6mlkdjpqopg9f04cdeanrau61ccetfbeg7@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:49:12 -0400, -hh wrote:
>>
>>>> Further as trustees of the SSA, the fact they have bleed the assets
>>>> into
>>>> ultralow yield government bonds should be grounds from criminal
>>>> charges.>
>>>> I mean if I took my parent's trust fund and invested it in special low
>>>> yield stock in my company... I would be charged with embezzlement...
>>>> but
>>>> not Congress critters.
>>>
>>> But if it were invested in the private sector, you'd be complaining that
>>> it is "choosing winners & losers".
>>
>> *applause*
>
> Perhaps, but going with a straight fortune 500 might be a good start.

That's still picking ... and Small Businesses would be disadvantaged.

> Better than the return the substandard government securities have, which
> is just us paying the interest, as well as the principle they have
> 'borrowed'.

Except that those securities have low returns because they're considered
to be low/lowest risk: fundamentally, the Market works from how higher
returns require higher risk (including risk of total loss).

> We're barely making inflation rates with 3% interest. That's a pretty
> shitty retirement account that gains no value.....

If your money is only making 3%, sounds like you need to shop around
more: there's FDIC insured savings accounts currently paying 5% APR.

Plus don't forget that Social Security isn't only a pension, but is also
a disability insurance policy throughout one's working years: that
needs to be considered as well when one tries to assess its 'yield'.

-hh

On 8/28/2024 4:20 PM, John Smyth wrote:
> [bullshit]

Trump has no plan to lower inflation. Inflation is already low.

He also has no plan to lower prices.

On Mon, 9 Sep 2024 10:51:14 -0500, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

>
>
>"Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:6mlkdjpqopg9f04cdeanrau61ccetfbeg7@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:49:12 -0400, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>> Further as trustees of the SSA, the fact they have bleed the assets into
>>>> ultralow yield government bonds should be grounds from criminal
>>>> charges.>
>>>> I mean if I took my parent's trust fund and invested it in special low
>>>> yield stock in my company... I would be charged with embezzlement... but
>>>> not Congress critters.
>>>
>>>But if it were invested in the private sector, you'd be complaining that
>>>it is "choosing winners & losers".
>>
>> *applause*
>
>Perhaps, but going with a straight fortune 500 might be a good start.
>
>Better than the return the substandard government securities have, which is
>just us paying the interest, as well as the principle they have 'borrowed'.
>We're barely making inflation rates with 3% interest. That's a pretty shitty
>retirement account that gains no value.....
>

SS pays off with no limit. No matter how long you live, you still collect.

And let's not forget what happened to the private investor market in 2008.

Exam question: What is amnesia? Is it
a) memory loss
a) memory loss or
4) The Battle of New Orleans

--
"Instead of building a wall or sending CBP agents to the border, why
doesn't the GOP send thoughts and prayers? It works so well for Mass
Shootings it should easily solve the border issue." - unknown

The non insurrection according to Tucker Carlson:
https://twitter.com/billmaher/status/1635677233787588609?lang=en

Not left, not right, https://www.forwardparty.com/

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"-hh" <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in message
news:vbnl59$2hbdt$2@dont-email.me...
> On 9/9/24 11:51 AM, Scout wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:6mlkdjpqopg9f04cdeanrau61ccetfbeg7@4ax.com...
>>> On Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:49:12 -0400, -hh wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Further as trustees of the SSA, the fact they have bleed the assets
>>>>> into
>>>>> ultralow yield government bonds should be grounds from criminal
>>>>> charges.>
>>>>> I mean if I took my parent's trust fund and invested it in special low
>>>>> yield stock in my company... I would be charged with embezzlement...
>>>>> but
>>>>> not Congress critters.
>>>>
>>>> But if it were invested in the private sector, you'd be complaining
>>>> that
>>>> it is "choosing winners & losers".
>>>
>>> *applause*
>>
>> Perhaps, but going with a straight fortune 500 might be a good start.
>
> That's still picking ... and Small Businesses would be disadvantaged.

Well, given small business loans, financial aid and such.. I think they have
enough advantage to overcome that.

Meanwhile, I will just acknowledge you're now having to make excuses.

On 9/10/24 1:48 PM, Scout wrote:
>
>
> "-hh" <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in message
> news:vbnl59$2hbdt$2@dont-email.me...
>> On 9/9/24 11:51 AM, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Governor Swill" <governor.swill@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:6mlkdjpqopg9f04cdeanrau61ccetfbeg7@4ax.com...
>>>> On Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:49:12 -0400, -hh wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Further as trustees of the SSA, the fact they have bleed the
>>>>>> assets into
>>>>>> ultralow yield government bonds should be grounds from criminal
>>>>>> charges.>
>>>>>> I mean if I took my parent's trust fund and invested it in special
>>>>>> low
>>>>>> yield stock in my company... I would be charged with
>>>>>> embezzlement... but
>>>>>> not Congress critters.
>>>>>
>>>>> But if it were invested in the private sector, you'd be complaining
>>>>> that
>>>>> it is "choosing winners & losers".
>>>>
>>>> *applause*
>>>
>>> Perhaps, but going with a straight fortune 500 might be a good start.
>>
>> That's still picking ... and Small Businesses would be disadvantaged.
>
> Well, given small business loans, financial aid and such.. I think they
> have enough advantage to overcome that.
>
> Meanwhile, I will just acknowledge you're now having to make excuses.

On the contrary: I've simply shown that you're only offering
lightweight fluff, not actually serious policy proposals.

For example, even if we were to say to put SS into an SP500 index fund
so that it can reap the Market's classically touted 8%/year average,
what are you going to do when there's a Market crash and the money's now
not there to pay this month's retirees?

Furthermore, what's the policy plan for when the SP500 stays negative
for 5+ years? For 10+ years?

FYI, don't try to claim that such timelines are impossible, because all
three of these (5, 10 years in the red) have already historically
happened repeatedly before. Indeed, there's even been one period where
the US Stock Market was underwater for 15+ years.

Summary: "invest better" is pathetically easy to say, but coming up
with a demonstrably better solution escapes those who make that claim.

-hh