Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a
good design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t go
without consent).
2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly (in
case of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of their
habitat. Here rapidly probably means without putting on a spacesuit,
unless one can design a spacesuit you can slip into in about 2 seconds.
3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters of
a colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient for the
number of inhabitants of a given habitat).
4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to work
without having to put on spacesuits.

My solution, and I am not sure it really is a good one, is to make
habitats in pairs. Have two habitats in a big tube, and a passageway
between the two habitats. The tube as a whole is pressurized, so you
don’t need an airlock to get out of a habitat. You would have airlocks
at the end of each tube. So once everyone is evacuated from the tube,
you can depressurize to put out a fire. You also need to have sufficient
ventilation capabilities in the passageway. If there is a fire in one
habitat, there is likely to be some smoke going into the passageway. You
don’t want to have to depressurize to get rid of smoke every time
someone burns his toasts.

Workspaces (offices, labs, machine shops etc) would be similarly paired
in tubes, albeit possibly much bigger tubes.

You can link the habitat tubes by the ends and sometimes on hubs. It
would be important to have a few hubs, not just a big loop with all the
habitats in a circle. Having crisscrossing “streets” allow you to go
anywhere even if you have a section that is closed because of a fire,
smoke or what not.

What do you think? How would you design a colony?

Alain Fournier

Alain Fournier suggested that ...
> Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a good
> design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
> 1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t go
> without consent).
> 2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly (in case
> of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of their habitat.
> Here rapidly probably means without putting on a spacesuit, unless one can
> design a spacesuit you can slip into in about 2 seconds.
> 3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters of a
> colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient for the number
> of inhabitants of a given habitat).
> 4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to work
> without having to put on spacesuits.
>
>
> My solution, and I am not sure it really is a good one, is to make habitats
> in pairs. Have two habitats in a big tube, and a passageway between the two
> habitats. The tube as a whole is pressurized, so you don’t need an airlock to
> get out of a habitat. You would have airlocks at the end of each tube. So
> once everyone is evacuated from the tube, you can depressurize to put out a
> fire. You also need to have sufficient ventilation capabilities in the
> passageway. If there is a fire in one habitat, there is likely to be some
> smoke going into the passageway. You don’t want to have to depressurize to
> get rid of smoke every time someone burns his toasts.
>
> Workspaces (offices, labs, machine shops etc) would be similarly paired in
> tubes, albeit possibly much bigger tubes.
>
> You can link the habitat tubes by the ends and sometimes on hubs. It would be
> important to have a few hubs, not just a big loop with all the habitats in a
> circle. Having crisscrossing “streets” allow you to go anywhere even if you
> have a section that is closed because of a fire, smoke or what not.
>
> What do you think? How would you design a colony?
>
>
> Alain Fournier

I expect that the first buildings will be very basic, like ISS modules.
The 2nd generation (of buildings) will probably build around the 1st,
perhaps connected by a hub. During both of these phases, most
facilities will be communal, with perhaps "private" sleeping closets,
but maybe also barracks style bunking. But of course, these will be
the advance team and not the Mayflower passengers.

It won't be before the 3rd generation that "apartments" will be built,
and that will probably be as a row of suites on a common hallway;
perhaps a hallway in front or in back. "Houses" will probably be a
long way off.

/dps

--
"This is all very fine, but let us not be carried away be excitement,
but ask calmly, how does this person feel about in in his cooler
moments next day, with six or seven thousand feet of snow and stuff on
top of him?"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain.

Snidely asserted that:
> Alain Fournier suggested that ...
>> Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a good
>> design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
>> 1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t go
>> without consent).
>> 2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly (in
>> case of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of their
>> habitat. Here rapidly probably means without putting on a spacesuit, unless
>> one can design a spacesuit you can slip into in about 2 seconds.
>> 3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters of a
>> colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient for the
>> number of inhabitants of a given habitat).
>> 4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to work
>> without having to put on spacesuits.
>>
>>
>> My solution, and I am not sure it really is a good one, is to make habitats
>> in pairs. Have two habitats in a big tube, and a passageway between the two
>> habitats. The tube as a whole is pressurized, so you don’t need an airlock
>> to get out of a habitat. You would have airlocks at the end of each tube.
>> So once everyone is evacuated from the tube, you can depressurize to put
>> out a fire. You also need to have sufficient ventilation capabilities in
>> the passageway. If there is a fire in one habitat, there is likely to be
>> some smoke going into the passageway. You don’t want to have to
>> depressurize to get rid of smoke every time someone burns his toasts.
>>
>> Workspaces (offices, labs, machine shops etc) would be similarly paired in
>> tubes, albeit possibly much bigger tubes.
>>
>> You can link the habitat tubes by the ends and sometimes on hubs. It would
>> be important to have a few hubs, not just a big loop with all the habitats
>> in a circle. Having crisscrossing “streets” allow you to go anywhere even
>> if you have a section that is closed because of a fire, smoke or what not.
>>
>> What do you think? How would you design a colony?
>>
>>
>> Alain Fournier
>
> I expect that the first buildings will be very basic, like ISS modules. The
> 2nd generation (of buildings) will probably build around the 1st, perhaps
> connected by a hub. During both of these phases, most facilities will be
> communal, with perhaps "private" sleeping closets, but maybe also barracks
> style bunking. But of course, these will be the advance team and not the
> Mayflower passengers.
>
> It won't be before the 3rd generation that "apartments" will be built, and
> that will probably be as a row of suites on a common hallway; perhaps a
> hallway in front or in back.

where "or" means "and"

> "Houses" will probably be a long way off.

I don't see "houses" before in situ building materials are in use,
which will probably require a significant support crew even if
fabrication is primarily with robotic equipment.

Your concern about suitless evacuation will probably involve
pressurized garages for excursion vehicles.

/dps

--
There's nothing inherently wrong with Big Data. What matters, as it
does for Arnold Lund in California or Richard Rothman in Baltimore, are
the questions -- old and new, good and bad -- this newest tool lets us
ask. (R. Lerhman, CSMonitor.com)

On 2024-10-07 6:05 p.m., Snidely wrote:
> Snidely asserted that:
>> Alain Fournier suggested that ...
>>> Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a
>>> good design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
>>> 1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t
>>> go without consent).
>>> 2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly
>>> (in case of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of
>>> their habitat. Here rapidly probably means without putting on a
>>> spacesuit, unless one can design a spacesuit you can slip into in
>>> about 2 seconds.
>>> 3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters
>>> of a colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient
>>> for the number of inhabitants of a given habitat).
>>> 4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to
>>> work without having to put on spacesuits.
>>>
>>>
>>> My solution, and I am not sure it really is a good one, is to make
>>> habitats in pairs. Have two habitats in a big tube, and a passageway
>>> between the two habitats. The tube as a whole is pressurized, so you
>>> don’t need an airlock to get out of a habitat. You would have
>>> airlocks at the end of each tube. So once everyone is evacuated from
>>> the tube, you can depressurize to put out a fire. You also need to
>>> have sufficient ventilation capabilities in the passageway. If there
>>> is a fire in one habitat, there is likely to be some smoke going into
>>> the passageway. You don’t want to have to depressurize to get rid of
>>> smoke every time someone burns his toasts.
>>>
>>> Workspaces (offices, labs, machine shops etc) would be similarly
>>> paired in tubes, albeit possibly much bigger tubes.
>>>
>>> You can link the habitat tubes by the ends and sometimes on hubs. It
>>> would be important to have a few hubs, not just a big loop with all
>>> the habitats in a circle. Having crisscrossing “streets” allow you to
>>> go anywhere even if you have a section that is closed because of a
>>> fire, smoke or what not.
>>>
>>> What do you think? How would you design a colony?
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>>
>> I expect that the first buildings will be very basic, like ISS
>> modules.  The 2nd generation (of buildings) will probably build around
>> the 1st, perhaps connected by a hub.  During both of these phases,
>> most facilities will be communal, with perhaps "private" sleeping
>> closets, but maybe also barracks style bunking.  But of course, these
>> will be the advance team and not the Mayflower passengers.

Yes I agree. I was thinking about "the Mayflower passengers" not the
advance team. Musk seems to want to get there fast.

>> It won't be before the 3rd generation that "apartments" will be built,
>> and that will probably be as a row of suites on a common hallway;
>> perhaps a hallway in front or in back.
>
> where "or" means "and"
>
>> "Houses" will probably be a long way off.
>
> I don't see "houses" before in situ building materials are in use, which
> will probably require a significant support crew even if fabrication is
> primarily with robotic equipment.
>
> Your concern about suitless evacuation will probably involve pressurized
> garages for excursion vehicles.

I'm not sure what you mean with that. If you have a party at home and a
fire breaks out, not all guests will have their excursion vehicles in
your garage (in fact there is a good chance that not all guests will
have an excursion vehicle at all). You might not want to plan on
everyone getting into the vehicle in the garage. Also, if you evacuate
via one excursion vehicle for many people, you have to make sure that
smoke does not fill the vehicle while boarding.

I prefer the hallway evacuation method. A long hallway with sections
separated by "sealable" doors. If some smoke gets in the hallway, you go
to the next section. By a sealable door I mean that not much smoke would
cross the door. Other doors would be air tight meaning you can
depressurise one side of the door but not the other side. Sealable doors
would be openable and closable as fast as normal Earthly doors therefore
suitable as an escape route. Airtight doors allow to extinguish fires by
depressurising a section once everyone is out.

Alain Fournier

On 2024-10-04 20:16, Alain Fournier wrote:
> Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a
> good design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
> 1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t go
> without consent).
> 2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly (in
> case of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of their
> habitat. Here rapidly probably means without putting on a spacesuit,
> unless one can design a spacesuit you can slip into in about 2 seconds.
> 3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters of
> a colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient for the
> number of inhabitants of a given habitat).
> 4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to work
> without having to put on spacesuits.

What comes to my mind is:

- Private quarters or apartments are implemented as large rovers, each
with its own (perhaps short-term) life support and power.

- These "mobile apartments" are docked to the outside of a hub. The hub
can be a straight hallway or a ring (a torus) or a larger structure with
more room. There would probably be underground rooms under the hub, too,
for radiation shielding.

- The hub has long-term life support and power supplies and, when large
enough, contains shared facilities like meeting rooms, laboratories,
workshops, restaurants, swimming pools.

If one mobile apartment has an emergency, such as a fire, the occupants
escape into the hub, the docking doors to the apartment are closed, and
perhaps the unoccupied apartment is undocked and moved to a safe distance.

If the hub has an emergency, the occupants retreat into their
apartments, close the docking doors, and either wait it out or undock
and move away and perhaps dock to another hub.

The hubs at a certain site should have enough free docking ports, in
total, to accommodate all apartments from any one hub that fails. Or if
there are too few free docking ports, apartments could take turns to
connect to a hub and resupply. Or apartments could have two docking
ports, perhaps one at each end, letting several apartments daisy-chain
to the same hub port.

The several hubs at a given site could be interconnected with tunnels to
allow people to move about and mingle without moving the apartments. Or
some apartments could be designed as public transport and make regular
trips between hubs.

If an apartment needs to take a longer trip, for which its own life
support and power are insufficient, it could tow or couple to a support
vehicle, as in "The Martian". Perhaps there could be "wagon trains" of
apartments all supported by a large "locomotive" unit...

On 2024-10-04 17:16:29 +0000, Alain Fournier said:

> Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a
> good design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
> 1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t
> go without consent).
> 2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly (in
> case of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of their
> habitat. Here rapidly probably means without putting on a spacesuit,
> unless one can design a spacesuit you can slip into in about 2 seconds.
> 3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters of
> a colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient for
> the number of inhabitants of a given habitat).
> 4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to work
> without having to put on spacesuits.
>
>
> My solution, and I am not sure it really is a good one, is to make
> habitats in pairs. Have two habitats in a big tube, and a passageway
> between the two habitats. The tube as a whole is pressurized, so you
> don’t need an airlock to get out of a habitat. You would have
> airlocks at the end of each tube. So once everyone is evacuated from
> the tube, you can depressurize to put out a fire. You also need to have
> sufficient ventilation capabilities in the passageway. If there is a
> fire in one habitat, there is likely to be some smoke going into the
> passageway. You don’t want to have to depressurize to get rid of
> smoke every time someone burns his toasts.
>
> Workspaces (offices, labs, machine shops etc) would be similarly paired
> in tubes, albeit possibly much bigger tubes.
>
> You can link the habitat tubes by the ends and sometimes on hubs. It
> would be important to have a few hubs, not just a big loop with all the
> habitats in a circle. Having crisscrossing “streets” allow you to
> go anywhere even if you have a section that is closed because of a
> fire, smoke or what not.
>
> What do you think? How would you design a colony?

The main problems on Mars are weather and the same as on Moon.
Therefore the design should be based on the design of colonies
on Moon and experiences from them.

--
Mikko

Watch this space, where Alain Fournier advised that...
> On 2024-10-07 6:05 p.m., Snidely wrote:
>> Snidely asserted that:
>>> Alain Fournier suggested that ...
>>>> Elon Musk wants to colonize Mars soon. I am wondering what would be a
>>>> good design for a Martian colony. I am assuming the following:
>>>> 1. Colonists will want to have private quarters (where others can’t go
>>>> without consent).
>>>> 2. Colonists will want to be able to evacuate their habitat rapidly (in
>>>> case of fire for instance). And do so from two opposite ends of their
>>>> habitat. Here rapidly probably means without putting on a spacesuit,
>>>> unless one can design a spacesuit you can slip into in about 2 seconds.
>>>> 3. Point 2, applies even if there is a party in the private quarters of a
>>>> colonist (therefore, you can’t just have a shelter sufficient for the
>>>> number of inhabitants of a given habitat).
>>>> 4. Colonist will want to be able to go see other colonist or go to work
>>>> without having to put on spacesuits.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> My solution, and I am not sure it really is a good one, is to make
>>>> habitats in pairs. Have two habitats in a big tube, and a passageway
>>>> between the two habitats. The tube as a whole is pressurized, so you
>>>> don’t need an airlock to get out of a habitat. You would have airlocks at
>>>> the end of each tube. So once everyone is evacuated from the tube, you
>>>> can depressurize to put out a fire. You also need to have sufficient
>>>> ventilation capabilities in the passageway. If there is a fire in one
>>>> habitat, there is likely to be some smoke going into the passageway. You
>>>> don’t want to have to depressurize to get rid of smoke every time someone
>>>> burns his toasts.
>>>>
>>>> Workspaces (offices, labs, machine shops etc) would be similarly paired
>>>> in tubes, albeit possibly much bigger tubes.
>>>>
>>>> You can link the habitat tubes by the ends and sometimes on hubs. It
>>>> would be important to have a few hubs, not just a big loop with all the
>>>> habitats in a circle. Having crisscrossing “streets” allow you to go
>>>> anywhere even if you have a section that is closed because of a fire,
>>>> smoke or what not.
>>>>
>>>> What do you think? How would you design a colony?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Alain Fournier
>>>
>>> I expect that the first buildings will be very basic, like ISS modules. 
>>> The 2nd generation (of buildings) will probably build around the 1st,
>>> perhaps connected by a hub.  During both of these phases, most facilities
>>> will be communal, with perhaps "private" sleeping closets, but maybe also
>>> barracks style bunking.  But of course, these will be the advance team and
>>> not the Mayflower passengers.
>
> Yes I agree. I was thinking about "the Mayflower passengers" not the advance
> team. Musk seems to want to get there fast.
>
>>> It won't be before the 3rd generation that "apartments" will be built, and
>>> that will probably be as a row of suites on a common hallway; perhaps a
>>> hallway in front or in back.
>>
>> where "or" means "and"
>>
>>> "Houses" will probably be a long way off.
>>
>> I don't see "houses" before in situ building materials are in use, which
>> will probably require a significant support crew even if fabrication is
>> primarily with robotic equipment.
>>
>> Your concern about suitless evacuation will probably involve pressurized
>> garages for excursion vehicles.

> I'm not sure what you mean with that. If you have a party at home and a fire
> breaks out, not all guests will have their excursion vehicles in your garage
> (in fact there is a good chance that not all guests will have an excursion
> vehicle at all). You might not want to plan on everyone getting into the
> vehicle in the garage. Also, if you evacuate via one excursion vehicle for
> many people, you have to make sure that smoke does not fill the vehicle while
> boarding.

Yeah, the suggestion needs a little more bike shedding, but then I
still don't think individual houses are likely for a long time, because
on Mars you don't just chop down a few trees to make a log cabin, or
bundle reeds together.

I think the resources required will dictate that the colony will spend
a long time growing as underground "domes" that serve as apartment
building and workshop, and that the apartment units will open on the
"commons", and may include an evacuation hallway on the "rim" of the
dome. Don't read this as saying the "dome" will be a hemisphere; I
think that shape will only be for specialized units, and that a
rectilinear or grid layout will be common.

The evacuation hallway could be where cables, air, water, and sewer are
routed, with additional trunks in sections of the "dome". Individual
units may have sealable doors that air-tight enough for emergency
purposes without necessarily being a long-term sealed hatch (consider
the airlocks on the ISS for examples of the latter).

I certainly don't expect the SpaceX illustration of a giant transparent
hemispherical dome enclosing green spaces and building ... at least not
in the first century of colonization.

> I prefer the hallway evacuation method. A long hallway with sections
> separated by "sealable" doors. If some smoke gets in the hallway, you go to
> the next section. By a sealable door I mean that not much smoke would cross
> the door. Other doors would be air tight meaning you can depressurise one
> side of the door but not the other side. Sealable doors would be openable and
> closable as fast as normal Earthly doors therefore suitable as an escape
> route. Airtight doors allow to extinguish fires by depressurising a section
> once everyone is out.
>
>
> Alain Fournier

/dps

--
Hurray or Huzzah?