Hello.

It looks like my very old 19" Samsung SyncMaster 931BF monitor is dying
since it has problems turning on (black screens, flickers to black and
display fast, etc.) on multiple desktop computers the last few cold
days. It is time to find a replacement.

-25" horizontal width max(imum)
-22" vertical height max(imum)
-Need to be able easily to rotate/move monitor due to the annoying sun
shining on to it since window blinds don't help. Glossy screens might be
problematic?
-Limited desk space due to bookshelves and stuff.
-Adjustable height.
-Tiltable.
-Still need VGA (still use it with my Beklin KVM from Y2K) and DVI ports
for old cables and computers (Linux, Windows, and Mac)
-No built in speakers unless they are included for free. :P
-Do a lot of Internet, watching videos, some gaming (action too so fast
speeds are required like <2 ms), basic graphic work, etc.

I noticed some current sales that might be good?
http://www.salescircular.com/ca/computer/mnitrp.shtml
http://www.salescircular.com/ca/video/tvsmlp.shtml
http://www.salescircular.com/ca/video/tvp.shtml

I want to see the new monitor in person with local retail stores like
Costco, Best Buy, Fry's Electronics, etc. before buying to be sure I
like it.

Thank you in advance. :)
--
Merry Christmas (*<:)})/:) Birthday Jesus & Holidays!
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On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 07:14:33 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>Hello.
>
>It looks like my very old 19" Samsung SyncMaster 931BF monitor is dying
>since it has problems turning on (black screens, flickers to black and
>display fast, etc.) on multiple desktop computers the last few cold
>days. It is time to find a replacement.
>
>-25" horizontal width max(imum)
>-22" vertical height max(imum)
>-Need to be able easily to rotate/move monitor due to the annoying sun
>shining on to it since window blinds don't help. Glossy screens might be
>problematic?
>-Limited desk space due to bookshelves and stuff.
>-Adjustable height.
>-Tiltable.
>-Still need VGA (still use it with my Beklin KVM from Y2K) and DVI ports
>for old cables and computers (Linux, Windows, and Mac)
>-No built in speakers unless they are included for free. :P
>-Do a lot of Internet, watching videos, some gaming (action too so fast
>speeds are required like <2 ms), basic graphic work, etc.
>
>I noticed some current sales that might be good?
>http://www.salescircular.com/ca/computer/mnitrp.shtml
>http://www.salescircular.com/ca/video/tvsmlp.shtml
>http://www.salescircular.com/ca/video/tvp.shtml
>
>I want to see the new monitor in person with local retail stores like
>Costco, Best Buy, Fry's Electronics, etc. before buying to be sure I
>like it.
>
>Thank you in advance. :)

Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
research it.

The thing is right now there is G-SYNC monitors and there is
everything else. Eventually there may be a war between G-SYNC and
VESA adaptive sync technologies, but Nvidia isn't planning to support
the VESA standard, they already have a solution today that works
brilliantly and probably always will work better than results that are
dependent on compatibility with open standards, and since they make
the best video cards (and have for many years now), that position is
not likely to change any time soon.

The probability of actually being able to your hands on one in person
at Costco or BestBuy or Frys is probably about the same as finding a
Costco or BestBuy clerk that is a knowledgeable PC gamer. No offense
but that plan of attack is barking up the wrong tree.

As far as your VGA and DVI requirements, that can be handled with
adapters.

Some say the ASUS ROG monitors have some sort of overagressive
anti-glare coating and don't like it because of it, but maybe that
would be a plus for you. Window glare specifically is usually easier
to manage with simple blinds/curtains or whatever than to buy a
monitor specifically to solve that issue, IMO.

The one I have is the Acer XB270H which is 27", larger than what
you've specified, but I promise once you game at 27" you will never go
back. If it feels a little too in-your-face for gaming, just do what
I do and put it on a stand which is easily slidable. I have mine set
up where I can easily slide the whole stand forward or back, usually
the distance range being about 3". Three inches is actually a lot of
viewing distance difference. I prefer it farther away for
reading/surfing/work and closer for gaming. It is incredibly
immersive when closer.

The monitors themselves aren't cheap, and if you don't already have an
Nvidia card that's an extra expense.

IMO AMD card owners would do well to dump their GPUs on ebay or
wherever and upgrade to Nvidia before the general public figures out
what is going on in the monitor space. I doubt AMD and the VESA
standard will catch up to this in the next three years.

On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 07:14:33 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>Hello.
>
>It looks like my very old 19" Samsung SyncMaster 931BF monitor is dying
>since it has problems turning on (black screens, flickers to black and
>display fast, etc.) on multiple desktop computers the last few cold
>days. It is time to find a replacement.

I have a 19" Hanns G monitor that does that when the cold weather
arrives. When I'm at work all day and the room temperature drops (from
what I understand from researching the problem) a cracked piece of
solder on the PCB in the monitor hardens and stops the monitor from
working.

I was going to throw it out until I read a message board post that
suggesting blowing hot air inside the monitor through the back panel
with a hair dryer. Lo and behold - it actually works. It only takes
about 15 seconds of warm air through a big slot in the top of the back
panel and on it comes. Once it's on it stays on too.

Apparently the warm air softens the solder which completes the circuit
and allows the monitor to function. I don't use that monitor very
often as it's on a PC that only gets booted about once a week. I
suppose I would get fed up with doing that every day if I had to.

Nifty trick though.
--
Rob

On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 16:46:20 +0000, Mr Rob
<noemailformethx@jsjsaiiowppw.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 07:14:33 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>>Hello.
>>
>>It looks like my very old 19" Samsung SyncMaster 931BF monitor is dying
>>since it has problems turning on (black screens, flickers to black and
>>display fast, etc.) on multiple desktop computers the last few cold
>>days. It is time to find a replacement.
>
>I have a 19" Hanns G monitor that does that when the cold weather
>arrives. When I'm at work all day and the room temperature drops (from
>what I understand from researching the problem) a cracked piece of
>solder on the PCB in the monitor hardens and stops the monitor from
>working.
>
>I was going to throw it out until I read a message board post that
>suggesting blowing hot air inside the monitor through the back panel
>with a hair dryer. Lo and behold - it actually works. It only takes
>about 15 seconds of warm air through a big slot in the top of the back
>panel and on it comes. Once it's on it stays on too.
>
>Apparently the warm air softens the solder which completes the circuit
>and allows the monitor to function. I don't use that monitor very
>often as it's on a PC that only gets booted about once a week. I
>suppose I would get fed up with doing that every day if I had to.
>
>Nifty trick though.

In addition to temp cycling with regard to electronics, I'm also
careful about maintaining ideal humidity levels throughout my place,
not only because of computers and such but I have musical equipment
that's not only expensive but would be hard to replace.

Most people are aware of the temperatures in their living area (and
usually those temperature ranges aren't drastic enough to be too hard
on electronics) but often less attention is given to maintaining
relatively stable humidity levels.

A lot of times cracking is more a symptom of dry air than it is
shrinkage from cold (unless it's in extreme cold like outside). It
might seem counterintuitive that a hair dryer helps (but that is
because the effect of very high temps as opposed to a furnace or
whatever that is keeping air warm enough for comfort yet dehumidifying
it down to unacceptable levels).

On 12/24/2014 7:43 AM PT, Rin Stowleigh typed:

> Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
> for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
> just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
> research it.

Well, I don't want to spend a lot of money. $200-300 is OK, but nothing
more!

> The thing is right now there is G-SYNC monitors and there is
> everything else. Eventually there may be a war between G-SYNC and
> VESA adaptive sync technologies, but Nvidia isn't planning to support
> the VESA standard, they already have a solution today that works
> brilliantly and probably always will work better than results that are
> dependent on compatibility with open standards, and since they make
> the best video cards (and have for many years now), that position is
> not likely to change any time soon.

G-SYNC is new to me. Do monitor specifications will say this on their
descriptions? I have not seen any of these so far. I saw IPS, LED, etc.
We still use VESA today? I remember VESA from DOS days! Wow.

> The probability of actually being able to your hands on one in person
> at Costco or BestBuy or Frys is probably about the same as finding a
> Costco or BestBuy clerk that is a knowledgeable PC gamer. No offense
> but that plan of attack is barking up the wrong tree.
>
> As far as your VGA and DVI requirements, that can be handled with
> adapters.

Currently, my old video cards (GeForce 8800 GT and ATI Radeon 4870) use
DVI ports and VGA adapters for VGA cables to my KVM to my old monitor. I
also have a direct DVI cable from one of my computers to the old monitor
so I can have low native non-stretched low screen resolutions for old
stuff like MAME.

> Some say the ASUS ROG monitors have some sort of overagressive
> anti-glare coating and don't like it because of it, but maybe that
> would be a plus for you. Window glare specifically is usually easier
> to manage with simple blinds/curtains or whatever than to buy a
> monitor specifically to solve that issue, IMO.

Well, my window rolling blinds do not do well to block a lot of sun in
the mornings and afternoon hours. I have to turn my monitor around a
little to avoid the glares on my old non-glossy monitor. :(

> The one I have is the Acer XB270H which is 27", larger than what
> you've specified, but I promise once you game at 27" you will never go
> back. If it feels a little too in-your-face for gaming, just do what

Small desk space and room are the problems, especially if I am going to
turn my monitor around to avoid the sun from the room's closed window.

> I do and put it on a stand which is easily slidable. I have mine set
> up where I can easily slide the whole stand forward or back, usually
> the distance range being about 3". Three inches is actually a lot of
> viewing distance difference. I prefer it farther away for
> reading/surfing/work and closer for gaming. It is incredibly
> immersive when closer.

I am near sighted so I will be close up. Currently, I am about 10 inches
("). from the screen. I don't wear eye glasses too.

> The monitors themselves aren't cheap, and if you don't already have an
> Nvidia card that's an extra expense.

I am planning to upgrade my very old video cards later on.
--
Merry Christmas (*<:)})/:) Birthday Jesus & Holidays!
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
( ) If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.

On 12/24/2014 8:46 AM PT, Mr Rob typed:

>> It looks like my very old 19" Samsung SyncMaster 931BF monitor is dying
>> since it has problems turning on (black screens, flickers to black and
>> display fast, etc.) on multiple desktop computers the last few cold
>> days. It is time to find a replacement.
>
> I have a 19" Hanns G monitor that does that when the cold weather
> arrives. When I'm at work all day and the room temperature drops (from
> what I understand from researching the problem) a cracked piece of
> solder on the PCB in the monitor hardens and stops the monitor from
> working.
>
> I was going to throw it out until I read a message board post that
> suggesting blowing hot air inside the monitor through the back panel
> with a hair dryer. Lo and behold - it actually works. It only takes
> about 15 seconds of warm air through a big slot in the top of the back
> panel and on it comes. Once it's on it stays on too.
>
> Apparently the warm air softens the solder which completes the circuit
> and allows the monitor to function. I don't use that monitor very
> often as it's on a PC that only gets booted about once a week. I
> suppose I would get fed up with doing that every day if I had to.

Interesting. Does it still work? I also noticed when the weather is hot
(e.g., 80+F degrees), the monitor's power button light flickers and
sometimes does not work (e.g., turn off, it turns on again -- haha).
Either way, my old monitor is getting worse in terms of power on/off so
I might as well replace it before it is totally dead. ;)
--
Merry Christmas (*<:)})/:) Birthday Jesus & Holidays!
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
( ) If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.

On 12/24/2014 9:25 AM PT, Rin Stowleigh typed:

> In addition to temp cycling with regard to electronics, I'm also
> careful about maintaining ideal humidity levels throughout my place,
> not only because of computers and such but I have musical equipment
> that's not only expensive but would be hard to replace.
>
> Most people are aware of the temperatures in their living area (and
> usually those temperature ranges aren't drastic enough to be too hard
> on electronics) but often less attention is given to maintaining
> relatively stable humidity levels.
>
> A lot of times cracking is more a symptom of dry air than it is
> shrinkage from cold (unless it's in extreme cold like outside). It
> might seem counterintuitive that a hair dryer helps (but that is
> because the effect of very high temps as opposed to a furnace or
> whatever that is keeping air warm enough for comfort yet dehumidifying
> it down to unacceptable levels).

Interesting. My rooms were cold as 60F degrees and hot up to almost 90F
degrees. Also, my rooms got dusty too. :(
--
Merry Christmas (*<:)})/:) Birthday Jesus & Holidays!
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
( ) If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.

On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 10:26:32 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>On 12/24/2014 7:43 AM PT, Rin Stowleigh typed:
>
>> Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
>> for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
>> just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
>> research it.
>
>Well, I don't want to spend a lot of money. $200-300 is OK, but nothing
>more!

I understand the purpose of spending limitations, but a monitor is
usually a long-term piece of equipment that greatly impacts your
overall gaming experience. Some hardware purchases are expenditure
overkill, but with these monitors you really get what you pay for. If
you went from something like the 19" Samsung you have now to the Acer
XB270H, you would be floored.

On the other hand if you are already used to tearing, input lag,
microstutter and all the other problems inherent to non G-SYNC LCD
monitors, staying with something no worse than what you have is not
going to feel like a downgrade.

What I would do if I really wanted to save money is just buy something
like the 931bf Monitor repair Kit (new capacitors) for your existing
monitor for ten bucks off Amazon and be done with it. I wouldn't look
to upgrade until I was ready to do it right, but to each his own I
guess.

>
>> The thing is right now there is G-SYNC monitors and there is
>> everything else. Eventually there may be a war between G-SYNC and
>> VESA adaptive sync technologies, but Nvidia isn't planning to support
>> the VESA standard, they already have a solution today that works
>> brilliantly and probably always will work better than results that are
>> dependent on compatibility with open standards, and since they make
>> the best video cards (and have for many years now), that position is
>> not likely to change any time soon.
>
>G-SYNC is new to me. Do monitor specifications will say this on their
>descriptions? I have not seen any of these so far. I saw IPS, LED, etc.
>We still use VESA today? I remember VESA from DOS days! Wow.

They are very new in general. Yes the monitor specs and advertisement
should list them specifically as a 144hz GSYNC monitor, or they do not
have the required hardware inside the monitor. There is a 24" ASUS
that you can buy which can be retrofitted with the G SYNC kit later.
http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/g-sync/diy

>
>> The probability of actually being able to your hands on one in person
>> at Costco or BestBuy or Frys is probably about the same as finding a
>> Costco or BestBuy clerk that is a knowledgeable PC gamer. No offense
>> but that plan of attack is barking up the wrong tree.
>>
>> As far as your VGA and DVI requirements, that can be handled with
>> adapters.
>
>Currently, my old video cards (GeForce 8800 GT and ATI Radeon 4870) use
>DVI ports and VGA adapters for VGA cables to my KVM to my old monitor. I
>also have a direct DVI cable from one of my computers to the old monitor
>so I can have low native non-stretched low screen resolutions for old
>stuff like MAME.

I also generally don't care for non-native resolutions, but I should
also point something out: This monitor was my upgrade from a CRT.

Yep -- even in the year 2014, despite buying many LCD monitors over
the years for non-gaming purposes, I refused to deal with all of the
horrible limitations and side effects of modern LCDs (most of which
are particularly pronounced with fast paced action games). Native vs
non-native resolutions were one of the reasons I held out for so long.
It was bad enough that I had a stash of two more spare 22" 1600x1200
CRTs for when my primary one died (it was still going strong when I
retired it). I was unwilling to deal with blur/input
lag/tearing/stuttering etc. caused by monitor technology that was
designed to enhance text and be more energy efficient, but was never
designed to facilitate action gaming.

So, the fact that I can say this monitor is a big upgrade over my CRTs
is a huge statement about the technology.

About MAME, I have only had this monitor a couple of months and have
only run a couple of MAME games so far to see how well it does as an
arcade replacement, but in the tests I've done were very impressed and
yes it was definitely an upgrade over my CRT (which ironically is what
arcade games were originally developed for). The increased brightness
and color richness of an LCD over an aging CRT (remember all monitors
lose their luster over time) for example makes Donkey Kong look much
more authentic in the sense of being reminiscent of a brand new game
cabinet from the 80's, as opposed to a cabinet that's been sitting in
a smoky bar for a decade or two. No, it's not running at native
resolution but the net effect isn't really that different than a low
resolution game running on a giant arcade monitor as it did back in
the day. In other words, don't worry, MAME and GSYNC make for good
bedfellows.

>
>> Some say the ASUS ROG monitors have some sort of overagressive
>> anti-glare coating and don't like it because of it, but maybe that
>> would be a plus for you. Window glare specifically is usually easier
>> to manage with simple blinds/curtains or whatever than to buy a
>> monitor specifically to solve that issue, IMO.
>
>Well, my window rolling blinds do not do well to block a lot of sun in
>the mornings and afternoon hours. I have to turn my monitor around a
>little to avoid the glares on my old non-glossy monitor. :(

Cheap curtain rod and a dark colored curtain would solve that one.
>
>> The one I have is the Acer XB270H which is 27", larger than what
>> you've specified, but I promise once you game at 27" you will never go
>> back. If it feels a little too in-your-face for gaming, just do what
>
>Small desk space and room are the problems, especially if I am going to
>turn my monitor around to avoid the sun from the room's closed window.

The monitor itself won't be a problem there, the size of the stand you
put it on might though. I'm pretty sure you could work this one out
easily enough.

>
>> I do and put it on a stand which is easily slidable. I have mine set
>> up where I can easily slide the whole stand forward or back, usually
>> the distance range being about 3". Three inches is actually a lot of
>> viewing distance difference. I prefer it farther away for
>> reading/surfing/work and closer for gaming. It is incredibly
>> immersive when closer.
>
>I am near sighted so I will be close up. Currently, I am about 10 inches
>("). from the screen. I don't wear eye glasses too.

If small text is a problem for you, you'd love a 27" screen at 1080p.

>
>> The monitors themselves aren't cheap, and if you don't already have an
>> Nvidia card that's an extra expense.
>
>I am planning to upgrade my very old video cards later on.

On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 16:46:20 +0000, Mr Rob
<noemailformethx@jsjsaiiowppw.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 07:14:33 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>>Hello.
>>
>>It looks like my very old 19" Samsung SyncMaster 931BF monitor is dying
>>since it has problems turning on (black screens, flickers to black and
>>display fast, etc.) on multiple desktop computers the last few cold
>>days. It is time to find a replacement.
>
>I have a 19" Hanns G monitor that does that when the cold weather
>arrives. When I'm at work all day and the room temperature drops (from
>what I understand from researching the problem) a cracked piece of
>solder on the PCB in the monitor hardens and stops the monitor from
>working.
>
>I was going to throw it out until I read a message board post that
>suggesting blowing hot air inside the monitor through the back panel
>with a hair dryer. Lo and behold - it actually works. It only takes
>about 15 seconds of warm air through a big slot in the top of the back
>panel and on it comes. Once it's on it stays on too.
>
>Apparently the warm air softens the solder which completes the circuit
>and allows the monitor to function. I don't use that monitor very
>often as it's on a PC that only gets booted about once a week. I
>suppose I would get fed up with doing that every day if I had to.
>
>Nifty trick though.

You could get a heat gun expressly made for the bulk heating of
electronics. They're cheap, but maybe not worth it if you're only
gonna use it once.

The fact that the solder joint on yours is so touchy that a hair dryer
is enough to fix it would probably make it a tough one to spot.

Tim

On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 10:28:53 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>On 12/24/2014 8:46 AM PT, Mr Rob typed:
>
>Interesting. Does it still work?

Yes it does

I've been giving it "the hairdryer treatment" for about 3 years,
possibly even 4 years.
--
Rob

On 12/24/2014 11:51 AM PT, Rin Stowleigh typed:

>>> Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
>>> for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
>>> just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
>>> research it.
>>
>> Well, I don't want to spend a lot of money. $200-300 is OK, but nothing
>> more!
>
> I understand the purpose of spending limitations, but a monitor is
> usually a long-term piece of equipment that greatly impacts your
> overall gaming experience. Some hardware purchases are expenditure
> overkill, but with these monitors you really get what you pay for. If
> you went from something like the 19" Samsung you have now to the Acer
> XB270H, you would be floored.

How long do new monitors last these days? According to past experiences
like in http://zimage.com/~ant/antfarm/about/toys.html history, my new
monitors only lasted several years (e.g., five/5). I'd hate to buy
something expensive and then it didn't last long. :/

> On the other hand if you are already used to tearing, input lag,
> microstutter and all the other problems inherent to non G-SYNC LCD
> monitors, staying with something no worse than what you have is not
> going to feel like a downgrade.

With CRTs and my current LCD monitor, I have not noticed that. The only
thing is colors, small size, and the power issues.

>
> What I would do if I really wanted to save money is just buy something
> like the 931bf Monitor repair Kit (new capacitors) for your existing
> monitor for ten bucks off Amazon and be done with it. I wouldn't look
> to upgrade until I was ready to do it right, but to each his own I
> guess.

Nah. I am ready to toss this old monitor and get some better and a
little bigger. :)

>>> The thing is right now there is G-SYNC monitors and there is
>>> everything else. Eventually there may be a war between G-SYNC and
>>> VESA adaptive sync technologies, but Nvidia isn't planning to support
>>> the VESA standard, they already have a solution today that works
>>> brilliantly and probably always will work better than results that are
>>> dependent on compatibility with open standards, and since they make
>>> the best video cards (and have for many years now), that position is
>>> not likely to change any time soon.
>>
>> G-SYNC is new to me. Do monitor specifications will say this on their
>> descriptions? I have not seen any of these so far. I saw IPS, LED, etc.
>> We still use VESA today? I remember VESA from DOS days! Wow.
>
> They are very new in general. Yes the monitor specs and advertisement
> should list them specifically as a 144hz GSYNC monitor, or they do not
> have the required hardware inside the monitor. There is a 24" ASUS
> that you can buy which can be retrofitted with the G SYNC kit later.
> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/g-sync/diy

It's new? Hmm, I think I will wait then. I don't game that much these
days too. I do game once in a while.

>>> The probability of actually being able to your hands on one in person
>>> at Costco or BestBuy or Frys is probably about the same as finding a
>>> Costco or BestBuy clerk that is a knowledgeable PC gamer. No offense
>>> but that plan of attack is barking up the wrong tree.
>>>
>>> As far as your VGA and DVI requirements, that can be handled with
>>> adapters.
>>
>> Currently, my old video cards (GeForce 8800 GT and ATI Radeon 4870) use
>> DVI ports and VGA adapters for VGA cables to my KVM to my old monitor. I
>> also have a direct DVI cable from one of my computers to the old monitor
>> so I can have low native non-stretched low screen resolutions for old
>> stuff like MAME.
>
> I also generally don't care for non-native resolutions, but I should
> also point something out: This monitor was my upgrade from a CRT.

Ha, I couldn't find good new CRT monitors before I bought this Samsung
931BF monitor. :O

> Yep -- even in the year 2014, despite buying many LCD monitors over
> the years for non-gaming purposes, I refused to deal with all of the
> horrible limitations and side effects of modern LCDs (most of which
> are particularly pronounced with fast paced action games). Native vs
> non-native resolutions were one of the reasons I held out for so long.
> It was bad enough that I had a stash of two more spare 22" 1600x1200
> CRTs for when my primary one died (it was still going strong when I
> retired it). I was unwilling to deal with blur/input
> lag/tearing/stuttering etc. caused by monitor technology that was
> designed to enhance text and be more energy efficient, but was never
> designed to facilitate action gaming.

Yep. I still prefer CRTs. Heh!

> So, the fact that I can say this monitor is a big upgrade over my CRTs
> is a huge statement about the technology.

Wow, that good eh?

> About MAME, I have only had this monitor a couple of months and have
> only run a couple of MAME games so far to see how well it does as an
> arcade replacement, but in the tests I've done were very impressed and
> yes it was definitely an upgrade over my CRT (which ironically is what
> arcade games were originally developed for). The increased brightness
> and color richness of an LCD over an aging CRT (remember all monitors
> lose their luster over time) for example makes Donkey Kong look much
> more authentic in the sense of being reminiscent of a brand new game
> cabinet from the 80's, as opposed to a cabinet that's been sitting in
> a smoky bar for a decade or two. No, it's not running at native
> resolution but the net effect isn't really that different than a low
> resolution game running on a giant arcade monitor as it did back in
> the day. In other words, don't worry, MAME and GSYNC make for good
> bedfellows.

Nice, but GSYNC is expensive and new. :/

>>> Some say the ASUS ROG monitors have some sort of overagressive
>>> anti-glare coating and don't like it because of it, but maybe that
>>> would be a plus for you. Window glare specifically is usually easier
>>> to manage with simple blinds/curtains or whatever than to buy a
>>> monitor specifically to solve that issue, IMO.
>>
>> Well, my window rolling blinds do not do well to block a lot of sun in
>> the mornings and afternoon hours. I have to turn my monitor around a
>> little to avoid the glares on my old non-glossy monitor. :(
>
> Cheap curtain rod and a dark colored curtain would solve that one.

And have to replace this a couple years old white blinds. :P

>>> The one I have is the Acer XB270H which is 27", larger than what
>>> you've specified, but I promise once you game at 27" you will never go
>>> back. If it feels a little too in-your-face for gaming, just do what
>>
>> Small desk space and room are the problems, especially if I am going to
>> turn my monitor around to avoid the sun from the room's closed window.
>
> The monitor itself won't be a problem there, the size of the stand you
> put it on might though. I'm pretty sure you could work this one out
> easily enough.

How big is the stand?

>>> I do and put it on a stand which is easily slidable. I have mine set
>>> up where I can easily slide the whole stand forward or back, usually
>>> the distance range being about 3". Three inches is actually a lot of
>>> viewing distance difference. I prefer it farther away for
>>> reading/surfing/work and closer for gaming. It is incredibly
>>> immersive when closer.
>>
>> I am near sighted so I will be close up. Currently, I am about 10 inches
>> ("). from the screen. I don't wear eye glasses too.
>
> If small text is a problem for you, you'd love a 27" screen at 1080p.

My old compound eyes seem OK for my old monitor. My elder parents don't
like it. Haha. Another reason to replace it.
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On 12/24/2014 1:22 PM PT, Mr Rob typed:

>> Interesting. Does it still work?
>
> Yes it does
>
> I've been giving it "the hairdryer treatment" for about 3 years,
> possibly even 4 years.

Wow, but you do it rarely since you don't use the machine often.
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On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 23:10:03 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>On 12/24/2014 1:22 PM PT, Mr Rob typed:
>
>>> Interesting. Does it still work?
>>
>> Yes it does
>>
>> I've been giving it "the hairdryer treatment" for about 3 years,
>> possibly even 4 years.
>
>Wow, but you do it rarely since you don't use the machine often.

About once a week.

More than that and I think I would just buy a new monitor.

--
Rob

On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 23:09:18 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>On 12/24/2014 11:51 AM PT, Rin Stowleigh typed:
>
>>>> Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
>>>> for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
>>>> just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
>>>> research it.
>>>
>>> Well, I don't want to spend a lot of money. $200-300 is OK, but nothing
>>> more!
>>
>> I understand the purpose of spending limitations, but a monitor is
>> usually a long-term piece of equipment that greatly impacts your
>> overall gaming experience. Some hardware purchases are expenditure
>> overkill, but with these monitors you really get what you pay for. If
>> you went from something like the 19" Samsung you have now to the Acer
>> XB270H, you would be floored.
>
>How long do new monitors last these days? According to past experiences
>like in http://zimage.com/~ant/antfarm/about/toys.html history, my new
>monitors only lasted several years (e.g., five/5). I'd hate to buy
>something expensive and then it didn't last long. :/

I typically get a lot more more than 5 years out of monitors. It's
hard for me to say how long they typically last because of how I tend
to repurpose old hardware or sell it or give it away in some cases.
Sometimes a previously primary monitor might become a secondary
monitor in a dual screen setup if I upgrade. I have not yet had to
toss one out simply because it stopped working. I have a Viewsonic
that I bought around '05-'06 that had a power supply die after 2 years
- it was still under warranty so I sent it in for PS replacement and
it has worked fine ever since. It is starting to exhibit some burn-in
problems but since I'm no longer using it as a primary monitor.

I suspect monitor and TV longevity is like a lot of things, how well
they hold up will depend on the environmental conditions around them,
and I'm diligent about temp/humidity levels so maybe I get more life
out of electronics than average.

One way or the other I see a monitor as a long-term use item, maybe
7-8 years on average?

>
>> On the other hand if you are already used to tearing, input lag,
>> microstutter and all the other problems inherent to non G-SYNC LCD
>> monitors, staying with something no worse than what you have is not
>> going to feel like a downgrade.
>
>With CRTs and my current LCD monitor, I have not noticed that. The only
>thing is colors, small size, and the power issues.

You probably wouldn't see stutter/input lag much on a CRT, and you'd
be unlikely to see tearing if you tend to sync to the refresh rate of
the monitor (and since CRTs have a variety of refresh rates available,
it tends to not be as much of an issue in most games). As far as the
current LCD monitor, I have no experience with the model you have but
most of the LCDs I've tried prior to this one bothered me in some way,
whether blurring or whatever.

Blur Busters is a decent website to learn about some of the issues
that are inherent to LCDs (most of which BTW are solved, at least to
acceptable levels, with GSYNC). http://www.blurbusters.com/

>>
>> What I would do if I really wanted to save money is just buy something
>> like the 931bf Monitor repair Kit (new capacitors) for your existing
>> monitor for ten bucks off Amazon and be done with it. I wouldn't look
>> to upgrade until I was ready to do it right, but to each his own I
>> guess.
>
>Nah. I am ready to toss this old monitor and get some better and a
>little bigger. :)
>
>>>> The thing is right now there is G-SYNC monitors and there is
>>>> everything else. Eventually there may be a war between G-SYNC and
>>>> VESA adaptive sync technologies, but Nvidia isn't planning to support
>>>> the VESA standard, they already have a solution today that works
>>>> brilliantly and probably always will work better than results that are
>>>> dependent on compatibility with open standards, and since they make
>>>> the best video cards (and have for many years now), that position is
>>>> not likely to change any time soon.
>>>
>>> G-SYNC is new to me. Do monitor specifications will say this on their
>>> descriptions? I have not seen any of these so far. I saw IPS, LED, etc.
>>> We still use VESA today? I remember VESA from DOS days! Wow.
>>
>> They are very new in general. Yes the monitor specs and advertisement
>> should list them specifically as a 144hz GSYNC monitor, or they do not
>> have the required hardware inside the monitor. There is a 24" ASUS
>> that you can buy which can be retrofitted with the G SYNC kit later.
>> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/g-sync/diy
>
>It's new? Hmm, I think I will wait then. I don't game that much these
>days too. I do game once in a while.

I think that kit has been out for close to a year, but G-SYNC in
general is a new technology. I wouldn't let that be a turn off,
Nvidia is very good about not releasing things that are half-baked and
they are second-to-none with regard to working with outside vendors to
be sure things are done right.

I have heard zero complaints about G-SYNC itself as a technology. Some
folks have expressed concerns about certain monitors (like some folks
think the menus on the ASUS monitors are screwy) but that's a vendor
specific niggle that comes down to individual preferences for
monitors.

>
>>>> The probability of actually being able to your hands on one in person
>>>> at Costco or BestBuy or Frys is probably about the same as finding a
>>>> Costco or BestBuy clerk that is a knowledgeable PC gamer. No offense
>>>> but that plan of attack is barking up the wrong tree.
>>>>
>>>> As far as your VGA and DVI requirements, that can be handled with
>>>> adapters.
>>>
>>> Currently, my old video cards (GeForce 8800 GT and ATI Radeon 4870) use
>>> DVI ports and VGA adapters for VGA cables to my KVM to my old monitor. I
>>> also have a direct DVI cable from one of my computers to the old monitor
>>> so I can have low native non-stretched low screen resolutions for old
>>> stuff like MAME.
>>
>> I also generally don't care for non-native resolutions, but I should
>> also point something out: This monitor was my upgrade from a CRT.
>
>Ha, I couldn't find good new CRT monitors before I bought this Samsung
>931BF monitor. :O

They went the way of the dinosaurs.

>> Yep -- even in the year 2014, despite buying many LCD monitors over
>> the years for non-gaming purposes, I refused to deal with all of the
>> horrible limitations and side effects of modern LCDs (most of which
>> are particularly pronounced with fast paced action games). Native vs
>> non-native resolutions were one of the reasons I held out for so long.
>> It was bad enough that I had a stash of two more spare 22" 1600x1200
>> CRTs for when my primary one died (it was still going strong when I
>> retired it). I was unwilling to deal with blur/input
>> lag/tearing/stuttering etc. caused by monitor technology that was
>> designed to enhance text and be more energy efficient, but was never
>> designed to facilitate action gaming.
>
>Yep. I still prefer CRTs. Heh!
>
>> So, the fact that I can say this monitor is a big upgrade over my CRTs
>> is a huge statement about the technology.
>
>Wow, that good eh?

Yes. I can honestly say I no longer miss my CRTs.

>
>> About MAME, I have only had this monitor a couple of months and have
>> only run a couple of MAME games so far to see how well it does as an
>> arcade replacement, but in the tests I've done were very impressed and
>> yes it was definitely an upgrade over my CRT (which ironically is what
>> arcade games were originally developed for). The increased brightness
>> and color richness of an LCD over an aging CRT (remember all monitors
>> lose their luster over time) for example makes Donkey Kong look much
>> more authentic in the sense of being reminiscent of a brand new game
>> cabinet from the 80's, as opposed to a cabinet that's been sitting in
>> a smoky bar for a decade or two. No, it's not running at native
>> resolution but the net effect isn't really that different than a low
>> resolution game running on a giant arcade monitor as it did back in
>> the day. In other words, don't worry, MAME and GSYNC make for good
>> bedfellows.
>
>Nice, but GSYNC is expensive and new. :/
>
>
>>>> Some say the ASUS ROG monitors have some sort of overagressive
>>>> anti-glare coating and don't like it because of it, but maybe that
>>>> would be a plus for you. Window glare specifically is usually easier
>>>> to manage with simple blinds/curtains or whatever than to buy a
>>>> monitor specifically to solve that issue, IMO.
>>>
>>> Well, my window rolling blinds do not do well to block a lot of sun in
>>> the mornings and afternoon hours. I have to turn my monitor around a
>>> little to avoid the glares on my old non-glossy monitor. :(
>>
>> Cheap curtain rod and a dark colored curtain would solve that one.
>
>And have to replace this a couple years old white blinds. :P
>
>
>>>> The one I have is the Acer XB270H which is 27", larger than what
>>>> you've specified, but I promise once you game at 27" you will never go
>>>> back. If it feels a little too in-your-face for gaming, just do what
>>>
>>> Small desk space and room are the problems, especially if I am going to
>>> turn my monitor around to avoid the sun from the room's closed window.
>>
>> The monitor itself won't be a problem there, the size of the stand you
>> put it on might though. I'm pretty sure you could work this one out
>> easily enough.
>
>How big is the stand?

On Thu, 25 Dec 2014 17:22:38 +0000, Mr Rob
<noemailformethx@jsjsaiiowppw.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 24 Dec 2014 23:10:03 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>>On 12/24/2014 1:22 PM PT, Mr Rob typed:
>>
>>>> Interesting. Does it still work?
>>>
>>> Yes it does
>>>
>>> I've been giving it "the hairdryer treatment" for about 3 years,
>>> possibly even 4 years.
>>
>>Wow, but you do it rarely since you don't use the machine often.
>
>About once a week.
>
>More than that and I think I would just buy a new monitor.

I have a Samsung Syncmaster 214t on one of the secondary machines that
was intermittently going black. These are great monitors for photo
editing and other stuff. I replaced it because I don't have a ton of
free time, but I'm going to recap/resolder it after the holidays.

I'll take pics as I go and post some if anyone cares. Complete cap kit
for this monitor is under $10 and reflowing the CFL joints is free.

On Fri, 26 Dec 2014 15:46:21 -0500, Tim O <timo56REMOVE@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>I have a Samsung Syncmaster 214t on one of the secondary machines that
>was intermittently going black. These are great monitors for photo
>editing and other stuff. I replaced it because I don't have a ton of
>free time, but I'm going to recap/resolder it after the holidays.
>
>I'll take pics as I go and post some if anyone cares. Complete cap kit
>for this monitor is under $10 and reflowing the CFL joints is free.

That would be interesting to see.

I've had one or two other people tell me that monitors can be quite
easy to repair if you know what to do.
--
Rob

>> Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
>> for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
>> just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
>> research it.
>
> Well, I don't want to spend a lot of money. $200-300 is OK, but nothing
> more!

Heh. I found out Fry's Electronics stores have a sale for one of these
G-Synch monitors: http://www.frys.com/product/8352677 ...
http://www.benq.us/images/upload/lcd/xl2420g/xl2420g_1.jpg even shows
the parts inside the monitor. But yeah, over $600 is too much for very
little gaming I do! I might check it out in store just for kicks and
dream about it in for my distance future. :P
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On Sun, 28 Dec 2014 17:01:29 -0800, Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>>> Right now you don't want to buy anything other than a G-SYNC monitor
>>> for action gaming unless you want hard regrets a year from now, or
>>> just want something cheap to get by until you have more time to
>>> research it.
>>
>> Well, I don't want to spend a lot of money. $200-300 is OK, but nothing
>> more!
>
>Heh. I found out Fry's Electronics stores have a sale for one of these
>G-Synch monitors: http://www.frys.com/product/8352677 ...
>http://www.benq.us/images/upload/lcd/xl2420g/xl2420g_1.jpg even shows
>the parts inside the monitor. But yeah, over $600 is too much for very
>little gaming I do! I might check it out in store just for kicks and
>dream about it in for my distance future. :P

NewEgg says with promo code "BESTBENQ24" there is an addtional
discount off the $600 price, but I didn't jump through the motions to
see how much the discount would be. I'm guessing $50, would be
surprised if it is $100 off. I think I'd still rather have the Acer
27" at $600 than the 24" for a little less.

On 12/28/2014 5:11 PM, Rin Stowleigh wrote:

> NewEgg says with promo code "BESTBENQ24" there is an addtional
> discount off the $600 price, but I didn't jump through the motions to
> see how much the discount would be. I'm guessing $50, would be
> surprised if it is $100 off. I think I'd still rather have the Acer
> 27" at $600 than the 24" for a little less.

27" won't fit on my tiny desk with shelves. Heh!
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I finally bought the new monitor last night from
http://frys.com/product/6902147 ... ;) It's nice. I haven't used it
much. Although I noticed some of my 3D fish aquarium screen savers and
OTA TV 720p recordings look meh in fullscreen (blurry and
pixellations!). I am spoiled. :P

Thanks all. :)
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