I was looking for an update on all the optimism about Windows-on-ARM from
around June-July, and it looks like things have gone somewhat silent on
this front.

I found this site <https://www.worksonwoa.com/> that some indefatigable
volunteers have thrown together, so you can check on the state of WoA
compatibility. It is divided into two sections, “Applications” and
“Games”.

The “Games” section is a straight listing of about 169 pages. At 10 items
per page, that’s maybe around 1700 compatible items. Not a big number.

The “Applications” section requires you to choose from a list. So I chose
“Business”, “Database” and “Enterprise”, and it showed only 3 pages of
items. Then I added “Collaboration”, “Creative”, and “Productivity”, and
now I am up to 20 pages.

All in all, a pretty disappointing result.

On 11/10/24 1:23 AM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>I was looking for an update on all the optimism about Windows-on-ARM from
>around June-July, and it looks like things have gone somewhat silent on
>this front.
>
>I found this site <https://www.worksonwoa.com/> that some indefatigable
>volunteers have thrown together, so you can check on the state of WoA
>compatibility. It is divided into two sections, “Applications” and
>“Games”.
>
>The “Games” section is a straight listing of about 169 pages. At 10 items
>per page, that’s maybe around 1700 compatible items. Not a big number.
>
>The “Applications” section requires you to choose from a list. So I chose
>“Business”, “Database” and “Enterprise”, and it showed only 3 pages of
>items. Then I added “Collaboration”, “Creative”, and “Productivity”, and
>now I am up to 20 pages.
>
>All in all, a pretty disappointing result.

You are such a dense fuck, it'll take time, but the future ain't in hot
IntelAMD chips.

--
Joel W. Crump

On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 15:54:32 +0000, Joel Crump wrote:

> You are such a dense fuck ...

Go on, stop spouting hot air and prove me wrong.

Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

>> You are such a dense fuck ...
>
>Go on, stop spouting hot air and prove me wrong.

Free hint: few people have these devices, yet. That *will* change.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 16:37:01 -0500, Joel wrote:

> That *will* change.

That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.

Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

>> That *will* change.
>
>That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.

You mean like an IntelAMD's fan? Heh.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:

> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> That *will* change.
>>
>>That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>
> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan? Heh.

Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end. You seem to think that Windows
will somehow make the successful transition to some non-x86 architecture.
I am merely pointing out that it never has, and never will.

Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

>>>> That *will* change.
>>>
>>>That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>
>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan? Heh.
>
>Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end. You seem to think that Windows
>will somehow make the successful transition to some non-x86 architecture.
>I am merely pointing out that it never has, and never will.

I only care to the extent that Winblows sells hardware, I would delete
Win11Copilot, if I bought one with it preinstalled, but there will be
self-assembled ARM desktops before long, and Linux will be all the
more immediately viable on them. But M$ is going to support it more
and more, too, there's no reason it can't.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

DFS <guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca> wrote:
>On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>
>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>
>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan? Heh.
>>
>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>
>2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>
>I can hardly believe it.

Oh, yeah sure, your claim that Win13 will be great on my current 10th
gen i5, totally "rational", dumbass.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On 11/11/2024 11:23 AM, Joel wrote:
> DFS <guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca> wrote:
>> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>>
>>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>>
>>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan? Heh.
>>>
>>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>>
>> 2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>>
>> I can hardly believe it.
>
>
> Oh, yeah sure, your claim that Win13 will be great on my current 10th
> gen i5, totally "rational", dumbass.

I never said 'great'. Quit lying.

On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 11:17:52 -0500, DFS wrote:

> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>
> ... agreeing with each other about something irrational?

Even Microsoft agrees x86 is a dead end. Otherwise, why is it putting so
much (futile) effort into Windows-on-ARM?

Actually Windows-on-Qualcomm-ARM, which is why it’s futile.

On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 19:43:58 -0500, Joel wrote:

> I only care to the extent that Winblows sells hardware ...

That hardware comes from the PC vendors, and their enthusiasm for Windows-
on-ARM is not exactly effusive as of late.

> But M$ is going to support it more and more, too, there's no reason it
> can't.

It’s not up to Microsoft. People don’t buy Windows machines for the sake
of Windows; they buy it for the apps they need to run on it. That app
support for running natively on ARM hasn’t exactly set the world on fire,
as I pointed out in the posting that started this thread.

On 11/11/2024 12:18 PM, Joel wrote:
> DFS <guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca> wrote:
>> On 11/11/2024 11:23 AM, Joel wrote:
>>> DFS <guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca> wrote:
>>>> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan? Heh.
>>>>>
>>>>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>>>>
>>>> 2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>>>>
>>>> I can hardly believe it.
>>>
>>> Oh, yeah sure, your claim that Win13 will be great on my current 10th
>>> gen i5, totally "rational", dumbass.
>>
>> I never said 'great'. Quit lying.
>
>
> Oh did I misquote you, sir, you only meant I could boot it and suffer
> with it, like Win10 20H2 on my first gen i5, I had previously? Heh.

What's your definition of 'suffer'? Looks, speed, ease of
administration and configuration, open vs closed source?

Right now go ahead and, under whatever distro you've recently hopped to,
time a bunch of computing operations that are important to you: startup,
shutdown, reboot, file copy, file delete, file find, open large text
file, open large .pdf, open large image file, app install, app delete,
app launch, etc, whatever. Save the data in a file.

Years from now (might be 5-6 or more) you'll be resurrecting that file
when you install Win13 on your current hardware. Then time the same ops
under Win13 on the same hardware. I 100% guarantee you won't come close
to 'suffering' (by any reasonable definition) with the speed and
efficiency of Win13 compared to whatever Linux distro you're running now.

Don't sell that hardware, you heah?

DFS <guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca> wrote:

>>>> your claim that Win13 will be great on my current 10th
>>>> gen i5, totally "rational", dumbass.
>>>
>>> I never said 'great'. Quit lying.
>>
>> Oh did I misquote you, sir, you only meant I could boot it and suffer
>> with it, like Win10 20H2 on my first gen i5, I had previously? Heh.
>
>What's your definition of 'suffer'? Looks, speed, ease of
>administration and configuration, open vs closed source?

I'm not just saying it to say it - there were multiple, fatal problems
with 20H2 on the old machine. I couldn't even keep it on when I went
to bed, because of the racing fan, trying to keep up with M$ stealing
CPU cycles, which on that chip was draining. On a *timed schedule*, I
kid you not, the system would blue screen, about every three days,
always the same mysterious bug-check code, something about memory not
available yet even going to 16 GB didn't fix it. It was a *FUCKING
DISASTER*. The very same OS I first installed on the new machine, on
which is was a dream.

Meanwhile, the old computer had four times the cores, 2.8 times the
minimum clock speed, and four and then eight times the minimum RAM. M$
turned Win10 into a beta of Win11, and eventually those builds were
the only supported ones. They *lie* about system requirements.

>Right now go ahead and, under whatever distro you've recently hopped to,
>time a bunch of computing operations that are important to you: startup,
>shutdown, reboot, file copy, file delete, file find, open large text
>file, open large .pdf, open large image file, app install, app delete,
>app launch, etc, whatever. Save the data in a file.
>
>Years from now (might be 5-6 or more) you'll be resurrecting that file
>when you install Win13 on your current hardware. Then time the same ops
>under Win13 on the same hardware. I 100% guarantee you won't come close
>to 'suffering' (by any reasonable definition) with the speed and
>efficiency of Win13 compared to whatever Linux distro you're running now.
>
>Don't sell that hardware, you heah?

It'd be an interesting experiment, but it's not about benchmarks of
apps, it's about the OS even functioning in a basic, correct way. This
is why Linux is going to gain more and more.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 21:02:09 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 19:43:58 -0500, Joel wrote:
>
>> I only care to the extent that Winblows sells hardware ...
>
> That hardware comes from the PC vendors, and their enthusiasm for
> Windows-
> on-ARM is not exactly effusive as of late.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz61YQWZuYU

https://web.archive.org/web/20190306143348/https://www.computerworld.com/
article/2501405/windows-8-on-arm--you-can-look-but-you-can-t-touch.html

Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

>> I only care to the extent that Winblows sells hardware ...
>
>That hardware comes from the PC vendors, and their enthusiasm for Windows-
>on-ARM is not exactly effusive as of late.
>
>> But M$ is going to support it more and more, too, there's no reason it
>> can't.
>
>It’s not up to Microsoft. People don’t buy Windows machines for the sake
>of Windows; they buy it for the apps they need to run on it. That app
>support for running natively on ARM hasn’t exactly set the world on fire,
>as I pointed out in the posting that started this thread.

"As I pointed out", it's still early. You're expecting some instant
result, but it's been literally a month or two, a few years from now,
Win and Lin on ARM will be a major force.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 21:33:55 -0500, Joel wrote:

> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> I only care to the extent that Winblows sells hardware ...
>>
>>That hardware comes from the PC vendors, and their enthusiasm for
>>Windows- on-ARM is not exactly effusive as of late.
>>
>>> But M$ is going to support it more and more, too, there's no reason it
>>> can't.
>>
>>It’s not up to Microsoft. People don’t buy Windows machines for the sake
>>of Windows; they buy it for the apps they need to run on it. That app
>>support for running natively on ARM hasn’t exactly set the world on
>>fire, as I pointed out in the posting that started this thread.
>
> "As I pointed out", it's still early.

Did you indeed? Weren’t your past postings along the lines of “the
revolution is here already”, and even that Windows-on-ARM might be
“unstoppable”?

> You're expecting some instant
> result, but it's been literally a month or two ...

Only if you discount all the decades of past failures of Windows, on ARM
and other non-x86 architectures. In other words, only if you behave
exactly like the sort of corporate fodder that swallows the management
marketspeak whole without even stopping to think about it.

Remember Einstein’s definition of insanity: trying the same thing over and
over, hoping for a different outcome each time.

Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

>>>> I only care to the extent that Winblows sells hardware ...
>>>
>>>That hardware comes from the PC vendors, and their enthusiasm for
>>>Windows- on-ARM is not exactly effusive as of late.
>>>
>>>> But M$ is going to support it more and more, too, there's no reason it
>>>> can't.
>>>
>>>It’s not up to Microsoft. People don’t buy Windows machines for the sake
>>>of Windows; they buy it for the apps they need to run on it. That app
>>>support for running natively on ARM hasn’t exactly set the world on
>>>fire, as I pointed out in the posting that started this thread.
>>
>> "As I pointed out", it's still early.
>
>Did you indeed? Weren’t your past postings along the lines of “the
>revolution is here already”, and even that Windows-on-ARM might be
>“unstoppable”?
>
>> You're expecting some instant
>> result, but it's been literally a month or two ...
>
>Only if you discount all the decades of past failures of Windows, on ARM
>and other non-x86 architectures. In other words, only if you behave
>exactly like the sort of corporate fodder that swallows the management
>marketspeak whole without even stopping to think about it.
>
>Remember Einstein’s definition of insanity: trying the same thing over and
>over, hoping for a different outcome each time.

It's not complicated, it's being fully developed, being sold
commercially, it just takes a minute to get it on solid ground. I'd
be an early adopter, but the market will see the advantages, before
long.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

On Tue, 12 Nov 2024 01:05:54 -0500, Joel wrote:

> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Remember Einstein’s definition of insanity: trying the same thing over
>> and over, hoping for a different outcome each time.
>
> It's not complicated, it's being fully developed, being sold
> commercially, it just takes a minute to get it on solid ground.

In case you hadn’t noticed, the holiday shopping season is already in full
swing. The time to make an impact with the new consumers with a new
product range is NOW. Where is the publicity? Where are the promotions?
The road shows? The introductory offers? Your local PC shops should be
full of ARM machines in their window displays! Go to the websites, they
should be all over the home page!

There seems to be nothing. Have the PC vendors given up on Windows-on-ARM
already? Because all I hear is crickets.

Le 2024-11-11 à 11:17, DFS a écrit :
> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>
>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>
>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>
>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan?  Heh.
>>
>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>
>
> 2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>
> I can hardly believe it.

It's just a matter of time before the installation sequence in some
distributions ask you about your pronouns.

--
CrudeSausage
Paleoconservative, Catholic, Christ is king.
Trump is a legend.

On 11/12/2024 10:40 AM, CrudeSausage wrote:
> Le 2024-11-11 à 11:17, DFS a écrit :
>> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>
>>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>>
>>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>>
>>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan?  Heh.
>>>
>>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>>
>>
>> 2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>>
>> I can hardly believe it.
>
> It's just a matter of time before the installation sequence in some
> distributions ask you about your pronouns.

You know, it might actually happen. And NixOS will probably lead the way.

I send email reminders every couple weeks to woke and tranny fucks in
the game and OS world to keep their mental sickness out of tech.

"customizable top surgery scars" in a game? GTFO.
"Gimme 10 pushups" penalties for "misgendering" in a game? GTFO.

Even Red Dead Redemption 2 contains some serious woke bullshit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/RDR2/comments/r14imv/is_red_dead_redemption_2_woke/

It'll all stop when their products stop selling.

Le 2024-11-12 à 12:39, DFS a écrit :
> On 11/12/2024 10:40 AM, CrudeSausage wrote:
>> Le 2024-11-11 à 11:17, DFS a écrit :
>>> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>>>
>>>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan?  Heh.
>>>>
>>>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>>>
>>>
>>> 2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>>>
>>> I can hardly believe it.
>>
>> It's just a matter of time before the installation sequence in some
>> distributions ask you about your pronouns.
>
>
> You know, it might actually happen.  And NixOS will probably lead the way.
>
> I send email reminders every couple weeks to woke and tranny fucks in
> the game and OS world to keep their mental sickness out of tech.
>
> "customizable top surgery scars" in a game?  GTFO.
> "Gimme 10 pushups" penalties for "misgendering" in a game?  GTFO.
>
>
> Even Red Dead Redemption 2 contains some serious woke bullshit:
>
> https://www.reddit.com/r/RDR2/comments/r14imv/is_red_dead_redemption_2_woke/
>
> It'll all stop when their products stop selling.

I have had the Red Dead Redemption 2 game in my library since about
2020. I have yet to play more than two hours of it. It's fine, but
eventually you get to a point where you're in a camp and you really have
no idea what the heck you're supposed to do. I imagine you can go
anywhere and do anything, but I would like just a _bit_ of direction.

--
CrudeSausage
Paleoconservative, Catholic, Christ is king.
Trump is a legend.

CrudeSausage wrote:
> Le 2024-11-12 à 12:39, DFS a écrit :
>> On 11/12/2024 10:40 AM, CrudeSausage wrote:
>>> Le 2024-11-11 à 11:17, DFS a écrit :
>>>> On 11/10/2024 6:17 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 18:07:03 -0500, Joel wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That *will* change.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That’s what I mean by “spouting hot air”.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You mean like an IntelAMD's fan?  Heh.
>>>>>
>>>>> Look, we are agreed that x86 is a dead end.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2 GuhNoo idiots agreeing with each other about something irrational?
>>>>
>>>> I can hardly believe it.
>>>
>>> It's just a matter of time before the installation sequence in some
>>> distributions ask you about your pronouns.
>>
>>
>> You know, it might actually happen.  And NixOS will probably lead the
>> way.
>>
>> I send email reminders every couple weeks to woke and tranny fucks in
>> the game and OS world to keep their mental sickness out of tech.
>>
>> "customizable top surgery scars" in a game?  GTFO.
>> "Gimme 10 pushups" penalties for "misgendering" in a game?  GTFO.
>>
>>
>> Even Red Dead Redemption 2 contains some serious woke bullshit:
>>
>> https://www.reddit.com/r/RDR2/comments/r14imv/is_red_dead_redemption_2_woke/
>>
>>
>> It'll all stop when their products stop selling.
>
> I have had the Red Dead Redemption 2 game in my library since about
> 2020. I have yet to play more than two hours of it. It's fine, but
> eventually you get to a point where you're in a camp and you really have
> no idea what the heck you're supposed to do. I imagine you can go
> anywhere and do anything, but I would like just a _bit_ of direction.
>

go straight up and turn left

On Tue, 12 Nov 2024 10:40:52 -0500, CrudeSausage wrote:

> It's just a matter of time before the installation sequence in some
> distributions ask you about your pronouns.

Thou makest that sound like a bad thing ...

On Tue, 12 Nov 2024 14:16:57 -0500, CrudeSausage wrote:

> Le 2024-11-12 à 12:39, DFS a écrit :
>
>> Even Red Dead Redemption 2 contains some serious woke bullshit:
>>
>> https://www.reddit.com/r/RDR2/comments/r14imv/is_red_dead_redemption_2_woke/
>>
>> It'll all stop when their products stop selling.
>
> I have had the Red Dead Redemption 2 game in my library since about
> 2020. I have yet to play more than two hours of it.

Did an anti-woker just claim, not only to have a “woke” game in their
possession, but actually to play it as well?

On top of DFS admitting that they actually read The Guardian ... is
anybody in this noisegroup truly “right-wing” any more?!!?