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comp / comp.os.linux.advocacy / Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS MALICIOUS?

SubjectAuthor
* Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS MALICIOUS?Paul
`* Linux is now part of Windows (was: Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS MALICIOUS?)vallor
 `* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsPaul
  `* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsLawrence D'Oliveiro
   `* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsJoel
    +* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsDFS
    |+* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsLawrence D'Oliveiro
    ||`* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsDFS
    || +- Re: Linux is now part of WindowsLawrence D'Oliveiro
    || `* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsCrudeSausage
    ||  +- Re: Linux is now part of Windowsrbowman
    ||  `- Re: Linux is now part of WindowsLawrence D'Oliveiro
    |`* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsJoel
    | `* Re: Linux is now part of Windowschrisv
    |  `- Re: Linux is now part of WindowsPaul
    `* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsPaul
     `* Re: Linux is now part of WindowsLawrence D'Oliveiro
      `- Re: Linux is now part of WindowsSilver Skull

1
Subject: Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS MALICIOUS?
From: Paul
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2024 04:57 UTC
References: 1 2
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nospam@needed.invalid (Paul)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS MALICIOUS?
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2024 00:57:49 -0400
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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On Thu, 10/31/2024 3:17 AM, helpdesk wrote:
> On 27 Oct 2024, Fritz Wuehler <fritz@spamexpire-
> 202410.rodent.frell.theremailer.net> posted some
> news:3c95b7229926fcf5eab91ece3e5451d7@msgid.frell.theremailer.net:
>
>> [Original post to COLA only]
>>
>> The new notepad has some feature that seems malicious to me:
>> Ortographic control;
>> authomatic correction;
>> the possibility of continuing the previous NOT SAVED session
>> (this means that somewhere it store my informations).
>> I used the OLD notepad in order to read my list of password
>> without saving anything anywhere.
>> There is the possibility to "start a new session and ignore
>> the not sved changes" but...
>> There is a "notepad" old style somewhere?
>
> Presuming you're a Windows 11 noob.
>
> The new notepad stole the autosave feature from notepad++.
>
> It's very simple without making any config changes, file, close, no to
> save, close the prog. If you're click-addicted or lazy, you create your
> own security problems with lack of attention.
>
> A more literate person would have simply used Help, read how, then
> "Settings (?? in the upper right corner) > When Notepad starts > Open a
> new window.".
>

You can use Notepad.exe (win32) from Win10, on Win11, then compare them.
The old Notepad is closer to a WinXP era Notepad.exe, except
they fixed Find/Replace to work at normal speed on the Windows 10 one.
The decorations around the windows frame look different, which
is a hint about the era of each.

[Picture] Once loaded, click to magnify, using magnify cursor

https://i.postimg.cc/rFPCrghr/Win11-Notepad-Demo.gif

Paul

Subject: Linux is now part of Windows (was: Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS MALICIOUS?)
From: vallor
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2024 06:29 UTC
References: 1 2 3
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!feeder2.eternal-september.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: vallor@cultnix.org (vallor)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Linux is now part of Windows (was: Re: THE NEW WINDOWS NOTEPAD IS
MALICIOUS?)
Date: 1 Nov 2024 06:29:58 GMT
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On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 00:57:49 -0400, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote in
<vg1n4f$33tt8$1@dont-email.me>:

> On Thu, 10/31/2024 3:17 AM, helpdesk wrote:
>> On 27 Oct 2024, Fritz Wuehler <fritz@spamexpire-
>> 202410.rodent.frell.theremailer.net> posted some
>> news:3c95b7229926fcf5eab91ece3e5451d7@msgid.frell.theremailer.net:
>>
>>> [Original post to COLA only]
>>>
>>> The new notepad has some feature that seems malicious to me:
>>> Ortographic control;
>>> authomatic correction;
>>> the possibility of continuing the previous NOT SAVED session
>>> (this means that somewhere it store my informations).
>>> I used the OLD notepad in order to read my list of password
>>> without saving anything anywhere.
>>> There is the possibility to "start a new session and ignore
>>> the not sved changes" but...
>>> There is a "notepad" old style somewhere?
>>
>> Presuming you're a Windows 11 noob.
>>
>> The new notepad stole the autosave feature from notepad++.
>>
>> It's very simple without making any config changes, file, close, no to
>> save, close the prog. If you're click-addicted or lazy, you create your
>> own security problems with lack of attention.
>>
>> A more literate person would have simply used Help, read how, then
>> "Settings (?? in the upper right corner) > When Notepad starts > Open a
>> new window.".
>>
>
> You can use Notepad.exe (win32) from Win10, on Win11, then compare them.
> The old Notepad is closer to a WinXP era Notepad.exe, except
> they fixed Find/Replace to work at normal speed on the Windows 10 one.
> The decorations around the windows frame look different, which
> is a hint about the era of each.
>
> [Picture] Once loaded, click to magnify, using magnify cursor
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/rFPCrghr/Win11-Notepad-Demo.gif
>
> Paul

Very nice that Microsoft has added Linux to Windows, as you
displayed in your gif.

Meanwhile, I'm running a Windows app (Elite Dangerous: Odyssey)
using proton on Linux. No complaints (knock on wood).

--
-v System76 Thelio Mega v1.1 x86_64 NVIDIA RTX 3090 Ti
OS: Linux 6.11.5 Release: Mint 21.3 Mem: 258G
"Someone threw a beer at Trump. He dodged it. No doubt a draft."

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Paul
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2024 08:26 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nospam@needed.invalid (Paul)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2024 04:26:27 -0400
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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On Fri, 11/1/2024 2:29 AM, vallor wrote:
> On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 00:57:49 -0400, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote in
> <vg1n4f$33tt8$1@dont-email.me>:
>
>> On Thu, 10/31/2024 3:17 AM, helpdesk wrote:
>>> On 27 Oct 2024, Fritz Wuehler <fritz@spamexpire-
>>> 202410.rodent.frell.theremailer.net> posted some
>>> news:3c95b7229926fcf5eab91ece3e5451d7@msgid.frell.theremailer.net:
>>>
>>>> [Original post to COLA only]
>>>>
>>>> The new notepad has some feature that seems malicious to me:
>>>> Ortographic control;
>>>> authomatic correction;
>>>> the possibility of continuing the previous NOT SAVED session
>>>> (this means that somewhere it store my informations).
>>>> I used the OLD notepad in order to read my list of password
>>>> without saving anything anywhere.
>>>> There is the possibility to "start a new session and ignore
>>>> the not sved changes" but...
>>>> There is a "notepad" old style somewhere?
>>>
>>> Presuming you're a Windows 11 noob.
>>>
>>> The new notepad stole the autosave feature from notepad++.
>>>
>>> It's very simple without making any config changes, file, close, no to
>>> save, close the prog. If you're click-addicted or lazy, you create your
>>> own security problems with lack of attention.
>>>
>>> A more literate person would have simply used Help, read how, then
>>> "Settings (?? in the upper right corner) > When Notepad starts > Open a
>>> new window.".
>>>
>>
>> You can use Notepad.exe (win32) from Win10, on Win11, then compare them.
>> The old Notepad is closer to a WinXP era Notepad.exe, except
>> they fixed Find/Replace to work at normal speed on the Windows 10 one.
>> The decorations around the windows frame look different, which
>> is a hint about the era of each.
>>
>> [Picture] Once loaded, click to magnify, using magnify cursor
>>
>> https://i.postimg.cc/rFPCrghr/Win11-Notepad-Demo.gif
>>
>> Paul
>
> Very nice that Microsoft has added Linux to Windows, as you
> displayed in your gif.
>
> Meanwhile, I'm running a Windows app (Elite Dangerous: Odyssey)
> using proton on Linux. No complaints (knock on wood).
>

Yes, very convenient having access to two ecosystems at the same time.

I can run Linux Firefox as a rootless application at the same time as a Windows Firefox is running.

The Linux Firefox profile will be in /home/username (inside ext4.vhdx container)
and the Windows Firefox profile is in C:\users\username\AppData\Local\Mozilla
which is visible in WSL as /mnt/C/users/username/AppData/Local/Mozilla .

But most of the time, you're not thinking about paths, you're just doing stuff.

You need to know about paths, if cleaning tracking info from cookies.sqlite
and from DOM storage. Both copies of Firefox will need to be cleaned.

[Picture] Showing a rootless Linux Firefox application via WSLg

https://i.postimg.cc/L55WRD43/two-ecosystems-W11-WSL-Linux.gif

the WSLg is unaccelerated. If you run GLXGears, you don't get the
20000 of X11, or the 12000 of XWayland, you're looking at the 400
of a Terminal Services graphics stack. The stack is "pretty tall" as
graphics stacks go, a wonder of wobbly engineering. But it seems a bit
more stable than the Terminal Services graphics stack for WinXP Mode in Windows 7.
(WinXP Mode presented rootless WinXP applications on a Windows 7 screen.)
which was likely a source of inspiration for this project.

On Win10, you can use XMing for your X11 display (that's
what we used, the first time Linux Firefox was running), whereas on
Win11, there is WSLg for the graphics stack. I don't know
if WSLg was ever back-ported to Win10, but I assume not.

And installing this stuff, is still not super-automated. It's
like pulling teeth, getting all the bits and pieces done properly.
That's why I can't be sure about the Win10 lack of WSLg -- just
because I didn't get it to run, doesn't mean it isn't working,
just that I couldn't figure it out.

Paul

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Lawrence D'Oliv
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 00:39 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: ldo@nz.invalid (Lawrence D'Oliveiro)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 00:39:53 -0000 (UTC)
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On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 04:26:27 -0400, Paul wrote:

> And installing this stuff, is still not super-automated. It's like
> pulling teeth, getting all the bits and pieces done properly.

That’s why they say, Windows is a great OS -- if your time is worth
nothing.

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Joel
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 01:41 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6
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From: joelcrump@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2024 21:41:20 -0400
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Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 04:26:27 -0400, Paul wrote:
>
>> And installing this stuff, is still not super-automated. It's like
>> pulling teeth, getting all the bits and pieces done properly.
>
>That’s why they say, Windows is a great OS -- if your time is worth
>nothing.

Just try updating either supported version with a spinning disk, see
how far it gets in how long. They'd say you can retrofit an aging PC
with a SATA SSD, yeah great, even that would probably be damn slow on
pre-SATA III systems. Just a farce. The bloat of current Win10 is
only marginally less than 11. Winblows does indeed blow.

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: DFS
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 03:21 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca (DFS)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2024 23:21:44 -0400
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On 11/1/2024 9:41 PM, Joel wrote:

> Just try updating either supported version with a spinning disk, see
> how far it gets in how long. They'd say you can retrofit an aging PC
> with a SATA SSD, yeah great, even that would probably be damn slow on
> pre-SATA III systems. Just a farce. The bloat of current Win10 is
> only marginally less than 11. Winblows does indeed blow.

Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
on it and I can watch you eat your words.

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Lawrence D'Oliv
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 03:59 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: ldo@nz.invalid (Lawrence D'Oliveiro)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 03:59:18 -0000 (UTC)
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On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 23:21:44 -0400, DFS wrote:

> Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
> on it and I can watch you eat your words.

Win13 -- that’s going to be the one built around the Linux kernel!

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Paul
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 09:58 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nospam@needed.invalid (Paul)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 05:58:54 -0400
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On Fri, 11/1/2024 9:41 PM, Joel wrote:
> Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>> On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 04:26:27 -0400, Paul wrote:
>>
>>> And installing this stuff, is still not super-automated. It's like
>>> pulling teeth, getting all the bits and pieces done properly.
>>
>> That’s why they say, Windows is a great OS -- if your time is worth
>> nothing.
>
>
> Just try updating either supported version with a spinning disk, see
> how far it gets in how long. They'd say you can retrofit an aging PC
> with a SATA SSD, yeah great, even that would probably be damn slow on
> pre-SATA III systems. Just a farce. The bloat of current Win10 is
> only marginally less than 11. Winblows does indeed blow.
>

The thing is, you don't understand *why* it blows.

The story starts, roughly somewhere between Win2K and WinXP era.
They have a package management scheme. The same package management
is used today, as in WinXP era. A package could be as little, as a single DLL.
It's not all LibreOffice-sized packages.

The scheme has a scaling problem. It requires calculation of supersedence.
Which is, that a new update, replaces certain old updates. Or, that
a new update, needs a certain Servicing Stack Update or other pre-requisites.
Each "package" is about three lines of text. The Windows 11 updates are
traceable all the way back to WinXP. The WSUSSCN2.cab file is somewhere
between 1GB and 2GB of compressed three line text chunks. This is a lot of data to
digest. In the WinXP era, the file was 5MB in size. it's now 200x to 400x larger.

In the Windows 7 era, IT people complained to Microsoft, that a 2GB machine
used to calculate updates several times a day. The calculation of the updates,
used up all the RAM on the computer. The call center staff using the machines,
could not do their jobs, because the machine was out of RAM each time a
package calculation (Check for Updates) was being done behind their backs.

Later on, they tried to bandaid the situation, by using "Jumbo Updates".
Other computer ecosystems have used Jumbo Updates too. But any time the
packaging scheme seems to have changed, it's just a re-packaging of the
broken system, hoping to make it less broken (A Jumbo Update has a thousand
packages inside, each one needing a calculation to prove correctness).
The Jumbo Updates are called "Cumulative", but sometimes you find that
three of them must install, not just one update, so they aren't exactly
Cumulative either.

But the dependency calculator is very reliable. It just goes "exponential"
when computing what updates are required. The calculation was going exponential
back in WinXP era. A middle manager promised at the time "we will absolutely
fix this before the end of support for WinXP". Which was of course,
absolute bullshit. Nothing got fixed. The same scheme is underneath
the Windows 11 OS right now. The same exponential behaviors are still
present. You can see them in Task Manager.

Microsoft actually fitted *data structure compression*, so when the
dependency calculations are being done, there was a space time tradeoff,
by using less RAM, but requiring decompression of structures during
the processing. This is the change that allowed Windows 7 2GB laptops
to work at 10AM in the morning -- it was the compression that made it
work again. That's one of the few changes to Windows Update, which
was an actual technical improvement. There is some variation of this
idea, going on today, but because nobody discusses this stuff any more,
I don't know what the consumption pattern represents (it's kinda a sawtooth now).

The latest change, is a Delta Update scheme, which is similar to the
Mozilla .mar method of updating Firefox. Instead of downloading an
entire executable, you can instead download a binary patch and patch
the existing executable, then verify the hash is correct. But this has
no bearing on the cursed calculation. It's more creamy Ranch Dressing
to hide the brokenness.

But at its heart, the "exponential" behavior, the expanding those
three lines of text for each package and package version, that
hasn't changed. A SHA2 protects the integrity of the file, and
that takes the place of the SHA1 used in the WinXP era.

Is it slow ? Hell, yes, it's slow. The disk light does not flash
when it is "thinking". It's CPU bound. A faster CPU can make it go
faster, by a little bit.

Using an SSD of the SATA type, even if it is SATA II, has the
advantage of reduced seek time. This still affords some improvement
in a Windows Update calculation. But for the times where it is
compute bound and railed on one core, at this point, the storage
is no longer the issue. There may also be a requirement that the
calculation be a single thread of execution. Your 128 core CPU makes
no difference to the problem.

The Microsoft staff and even I, dream of using a different scheme for
package management. It's an area devoid of ideas. We're stuck with it.

If you prune the supersedence tree, that helps reduce the calculation time.
Repetitive updates such as KB890830, those have a huge tree. Internet Explorer
had a huge tree (many sub-versions). They smashed Internet Explorer,
they removed it, they damaged it on the older OSes, but part of this
is also a tip of the hat to the package tree. Removing it so it no longer
needs updates, shaves some of the exponential time off.

What if the product had fewer packages ? Hah! Like that's going to happen.
Look at the WinSxS (Windows Side By Side) directory, count the files,
that's a measure of how many update-able packages are in there. And every kernel
change can undoubtedly be traced all the way back to Win2K. The windows
kernel is one of the things with a huge tree tied to it.

If you are using Vista SP2, you go to Windows Update, you click the
Check For Updates, that operation never comes back. The exponential
behavior was so bad, it basically could not do updates any more.
The guys at WSUSOffline understood which items contributed to this,
and they could sort the order of package installation, to stop
the behavior so the process could gain traction again. But once the
signing change from SHA1 to SHA2 happened, I think that borked Vista
for good. Today, I don't think you can install Vista and patch it
Some of the others, are still patchable, slow, but they eventually
patch.

Good features: Never makes a mistake. Delete state info, it still
correctly figures out what needs updating.

Bad features: The algorithm is O(fuck). It's exponential. In the
case of Vista, the calculation never finishes.

When Windows Update is healthy, an update check
*cannot take less than three minutes*. That's the best
case behavior observed. That is the baseline. Everything
else is measured with respect to the three minute case.

https://tech.slashdot.org/story/13/12/16/1959259/exponential-algorithm-in-windows-update-slowing-xp-machines

Microsoft Windows

Exponential Algorithm In Windows Update Slowing XP Machines

Posted by samzenpus on Monday December 16, 2013 @05:57PM from the no-pep-in-your-step dept.

jones_supa writes
"An interesting bug regarding update dependency calculation has been found in Windows XP.
By design, machines using Windows Update retrieve patch information from Microsoft's update
servers (or possibly WSUS in a company setting). That patch information contains information
about each patch: what software it applies to and, critically, what historic patch or patches
the current patch supersedes. Unfortunately, the Windows Update client components used an
algorithm with exponential scaling when processing these lists. Each additional superseded
patch would double the time taken to process the list. With the operating system now very old,
those lists have grown long, sometimes to 40 or more items. On a new machine, that processing
appeared to be almost instantaneous. It is now very slow. After starting the system,
svchost.exe is chewing up the entire processor, sometimes for an hour or more at a time.
Wait long enough after booting and the machine will eventually return to normalcy.
Microsoft thought that it had this problem fixed in November's Patch Tuesday update <=== Microsoft *knows* it cannot fix...
after it culled the supersedence lists. That update didn't appear to fix the problem.
The company thought that its December update would also provide a solution, with even <=== The notion it was trying, is bullshit
more aggressive culling. That didn't seem to help either. For one reason or another,
Microsoft's test scenarios for the patches didn't reflect the experience of real Windows XP machines. <=== <cough> Hah!
"

Paul

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Joel
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 11:18 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
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From: joelcrump@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2024 07:18:48 -0400
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DFS <guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca> wrote:

>> Just try updating either supported version with a spinning disk, see
>> how far it gets in how long. They'd say you can retrofit an aging PC
>> with a SATA SSD, yeah great, even that would probably be damn slow on
>> pre-SATA III systems. Just a farce. The bloat of current Win10 is
>> only marginally less than 11. Winblows does indeed blow.
>
>Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
>on it and I can watch you eat your words.

That's laughable, dude, I didn't even like Win11 23H2 on my machine,
how would a version so far in the future be worth crap?

--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: chrisv
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: fastusenet - www.fastusenet.org
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 13:38 UTC
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From: chrisv@nospam.invalid (chrisv)
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Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
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> some dumb fsck wrote:
>>
>>Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
>>on it and I can watch you eat your words.

I suppose that by then it will be a requirement that you have an NPU
that scans all your files and spies on everything that you do.

--
'lie: "WinDOS is now unapologetically *spying* on its users."' -
DumFSck, lying shamelessly

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Paul
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:54 UTC
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From: nospam@needed.invalid (Paul)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2024 13:54:28 -0400
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On Sat, 11/2/2024 9:38 AM, chrisv wrote:
>> some dumb fsck wrote:
>>>
>>> Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
>>> on it and I can watch you eat your words.
>
> I suppose that by then it will be a requirement that you have an NPU
> that scans all your files and spies on everything that you do.

Even if your NPU is not "certified", it may still get a tab in Task Manager,
and during synthetic benchmarks, the activity can register. Only the
Qualcomm 40 TOPS NPU is "certified" at the moment. And "Recall" is not
running. While some parts of the rails are greased, not everything is there yet.

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/w_1456,c_limit,f_webp,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F3ea3a4aa-152a-40bd-9114-ffb63a992221_1183x811.png

*******

You might not need an NPU as such. The hardware companies are counting their
GPU as being available (still need software for this and a framework).
According to NVidia, the RTX 4090 is "about" 1000 TOPS (if they ever finish
the code for it). Although the fan spinning up and the PC using 600W
to do voice recognition, I doubt that is going to fly. You can see the
CPU would have to be an Epyc Milan to be a candidate as a useful NPU.

https://b2c-contenthub.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/06/Intel-Lunar-Lake-TOPS-across-segments.png?w=1200

NPU 48 TOPS <=== would normally be the most power-efficient, 12000 multiply-accumulate blocks
GPU 67 TOPS
CPU 5 TOPS

The blocks need more than raw compute power, they also have to support scheduling,
so that a percentage of the array can be used for one task, and another percentage
for a second task. The GPU already has such scheduling.

If Microsoft were a boxer, "why lead with your chin?". That part makes no sense.
They don't seem to have any application for their NPU invention. "Recall" is weak sauce.
It's the "Contoso" of developments, a lesson in "how not to do things". Should be
useful in guiding competitors (case study) on what to do or not do.

At the current time, this is what Microsoft offers to "check up on Microsoft".

Diagnostic Data Viewer <=== filled with crap, based on Telemetry feed.
Mine appears to have turned on Optional Drip Feed again.
Currently, this application will not install. Hmmm.
Have to run an EXE to install the APP.

Name: Diagnostic Data Viewer Installer.exe
Size: 1,058,336 bytes (1033 KiB) [Stub - the install is actually 10.9 MB]
SHA256: 791FC20CD674BDD594CB8294E96E9FE0ABF7EFB43D070FA5F74CE7CFA348AEA5

[Picture] Do they know my Location ? Location status is 512. Que ? Do you speek Robotz ?

https://i.postimg.cc/v822x4Qc/Diagnostic-Data-Viewer-Win11.gif

Privacy Dashboard <=== Log into Microsoft Account (MSA) and view the rest of the info

Presumably the "Recall" feature will play into this somehow. Maybe they will throw
us a table scrap. Some random text strings.

I hope DDV mentions that the News and Interest widget and the Weather widget,
cannot have the Location service disconnected from them. While third party
applications have smartphone-like controls for disabling Location Services,
it's the Microsoft application that cannot be gated off. You can "Hide"
News and Interests, but you don't have any other control over it.

Apparently, if you live in the EU, behavior is different.

Paul

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Lawrence D'Oliv
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 00:32 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
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From: ldo@nz.invalid (Lawrence D'Oliveiro)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 00:32:41 -0000 (UTC)
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On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 05:58:54 -0400, Paul wrote:

> They have a package management scheme. ...
>
> The scheme has a scaling problem.

This was the better part of a decade after the Linux community had
addressed the same problem and come up with a much more efficient
solution? Yet Microsoft insisted on burying its head in the sand with its
“NIH” attitude and tried to invent its own solution, and came up with
crap?

Should I be surprised?

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Silver Skull
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10, alt.comp.os.windows-11, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: novaBBS
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 03:34 UTC
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From: silver.skull@nopsam.com (Silver Skull)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 03:34:07 +0000
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On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 0:32:41 +0000, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

> On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 05:58:54 -0400, Paul wrote:
>
>> They have a package management scheme. ...
>>
>> The scheme has a scaling problem.
>
> Yet Microsoft insisted on burying its head in the sand with
> its “NIH” attitude and tried to invent its own solution, and
> came up with crap?

Same as it ever was then.

> Should I be surprised?

Nope

--
Vive Les Nordiques!

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: DFS
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 17:41 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: guhnoo-basher@linux.advocaca (DFS)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 12:41:01 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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On 11/1/2024 11:59 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 23:21:44 -0400, DFS wrote:
>
>> Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
>> on it and I can watch you eat your words.
>
> Win13 -- that’s going to be the one built around the Linux kernel!

For how many decades are you Linux wackjobs - on and off cola - going to
spew this idiocy?

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Lawrence D'Oliv
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 20:51 UTC
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From: ldo@nz.invalid (Lawrence D'Oliveiro)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 20:51:23 -0000 (UTC)
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On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 12:41:01 -0500, DFS wrote:

> On 11/1/2024 11:59 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 23:21:44 -0400, DFS wrote:
>>
>>> Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
>>> on it and I can watch you eat your words.
>>
>> Win13 -- that’s going to be the one built around the Linux kernel!
>
> For how many decades are you Linux wackjobs - on and off cola - going to
> spew this idiocy?

It won’t take decades for that prediction to come true.

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: CrudeSausage
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Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2024 23:58 UTC
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Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
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Le 2024-11-03 à 12:41, DFS a écrit :
> On 11/1/2024 11:59 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> On Fri, 1 Nov 2024 23:21:44 -0400, DFS wrote:
>>
>>> Make sure to keep your current hardware around so you can install Win13
>>> on it and I can watch you eat your words.
>>
>> Win13 -- that’s going to be the one built around the Linux kernel!
>
>
> For how many decades are you Linux wackjobs - on and off cola - going to
> spew this idiocy?

It's wishful thinking. To be very honest though, if NVIDIA were to
open-source their graphics drivers and allow the experience with its
hardware to be as stellar as that of Intel or AMD, Linux would stand a
good chance of gaining some market share. Of course, Linux has been
handed a bunch of disgruntled Windows users many times in the past and
most of them preferred to jump through hoops to keep using Windows
rather than adopt Linux. It's not that Linux is bad; it's that people
who already can't figure out Windows thought that their new operating
system of choice was going to hold their hand or something.

--
CrudeSausage
Paleoconservative, Catholic, Christ is king.

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: rbowman
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2024 01:47 UTC
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Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: 4 Nov 2024 01:47:20 GMT
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On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 18:58:05 -0500, CrudeSausage wrote:

> It's wishful thinking. To be very honest though, if NVIDIA were to
> open-source their graphics drivers and allow the experience with its
> hardware to be as stellar as that of Intel or AMD, Linux would stand a
> good chance of gaining some market share.

A current thread on r/linux by someone who solved all their problems by
dumping Nvidia for a AMD GPU seems awfully familiar...

Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
From: Lawrence D'Oliv
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2024 02:10 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11
Path: eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: ldo@nz.invalid (Lawrence D'Oliveiro)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux is now part of Windows
Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2024 02:10:10 -0000 (UTC)
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On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 18:58:05 -0500, CrudeSausage wrote:

> Linux would stand a good chance of gaining some market share.

Linux already dominates the computing world. Why do you think Microsoft is
being forced to make Windows more Linux-compatible?

The market leader doesn’t have to worry about compatibility with the also-
rans.

1

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